[dbral]

Maybe MMS will respond to this message as they are part of this forum or maybe this conversation will help others to make an informed decision before paying up front and ordering online as well. Protect your project and your money or this could be you.....

to Mike
Edit #7 of the same email of 2/13/2022. Your delayed responses allow me time to keep adding to the original text when something else comes to mind.

You are running out of time. You have not given any reason as to why you broke our agreement terms nor do you offer any acceptable compensation for failing to fulfill your terms. If you do not respond by the date that I gave then I have to assume that you and your company have, by default, negative intentions and will move forward with that in mind. This was supposed to be a fun build that my daughter and I could enjoy together but instead we have "this". Times up. I technically could argue quite successfully that I no longer need any of those parts, including the ones that have been sent. You have my current terms but those could change at any time.

MMS--My business is ran on my terms, not yours. We'll be doing the refund my way or not at all. I'm trying to refund you for the headers order now. If that's not good enough, then I guess we don't have to do a refund if that's how you want it. Take it or leave it."
---Well, that is not how I read your "refund offer" This is what you are actually trying to get by with and I quote...

MMS-"I will be mailing you a check as a refund for the order of the N-body headers and the associated parts on that order. I will not be charging you any restocking fee on this refund.

We will send you the remaining parts like the throttle body, pcm, etc"

--- That is not going to work. It is not fair to me because it is open ended, does not include dates or amounts, does not protect me from receiving a bad "check" and based on my 5 years of experience of dealing with MMS after paying 7600 upfront and still being owed thousands of dollars of goods and services, I would be foolish to accept that. My more than fair terms are stated in my last email. Take it or take it. You are the one who admitted that you could not come through and broke our agreement, not me. You have refused all of my more than fair past offers and ideas to help you fulfill your end of agreement YEARS ago, including a refund. I more than did my part and have waited 4 and a half years over promise time as well. Your turn. You are not the victim here. What would you do if the tables were turned and I was the cause of ruining your father/son project and I was treating you the way you are treating me? Either refund me per my terms, or send me the parts per my terms and ironically those are the same terms that we agreed upon over 5 years ago and the same agreement terms that you recently broke. Only difference is that I now added a completion date and a recourse for me if you fail to meet the date. You are getting a second chance to do the right thing and fulfill your obligation as per our agreement of over 5 years ago or you can refund me for what you still owe me. Take it or take it.

MMS---"it was a direct result of the customer trying to man-handle what is usually my job of picking out the correct parts, and because this was part of a lawsuit at the time....."
---Well, that right there tells me all I need to know. "Because it was part of a lawsuit at the time." How you managed to lose the trust of someone clearly willing to spend Mega Bucks on that build is something that I unfortunately understand all too well after dealing with you after 5 years myself. This is supposed to be a fun and enjoyable hobby, not some years long/say one thing do another/ frustrating/wish I never made the decision to deal with you mess that always seems to be the case when dealing with MMS for almost everyone. I really feel bad for that customer and others like him. Take a lesson from Wottech. I and many others love dealing with them. I look forward to dealing with Wottech and have fun doing so and I have always received my parts and received them quickly. Ironically, Wottech sent me, in a matter of days, the same parts that I have been waiting over 5 years for MMS to send. Possibly emulate their business model and maybe you can start to make a positive difference in MMS, your customers, and the N-body hobby as well. Just a suggestion.


Would love a chance to do the dyno comparison idea that I previously mentioned, but based on feedback from another stage 2 customer that you personally tuned, it would probably just keep stalling.... much like MMS. Oh, and It took that customer years to get their car back too. You are very inept at what you do. Just like me when I foolishly trusted what you said over 5 years ago. I am inept at not protecting myself from scams. It sucks to be inept. I can empathize with you on that.

MMS-"I mean I don't care really if you don't answer it for another year, I just find it kind of ironic."
-----I find it ironic that MMS is offering a refund on a non-refundable part and refusing to refund me on a refundable part.

Your competitor was able to provide me with some of the needed parts in days, the same parts that I have been waiting over 5 years for MMS to send. To be clear, I am not asking for a complete refund of 7600, just what MMS still owes me in parts. More than fair, especially considering the years of waiting, having to buy duplicate parts from your competitor, MMS ignoring the multiple, more than fair previous offers and opportunities to finish this build (and refund me as well btw), and obviously the main reason that this build was started in the first place. The "main reason" is well documented and public in case you forgot. I probably should be asking for a complete refund, but like I said before, I foolishly trusted what you told me over 5 years ago and did not protect myself. My 2 terms are clearly stated in my last email. Pick one please.

MMS- "There are so many things wrong with the things you say I don't know where to start. The only thing that cost more than $50k were the lawyers. His bill was $35k which never even was paid off. $5k was spent on a billet crankshaft we didn't need and I recommended against."
---- Post from MMS on 11/08/2017 "Anyways the total for all the parts and labor that we did is about $48,000." That is a quote from MMS directly. "About $48,000" is what MMS posted. That sounds like an estimation to me. So, between $46k and $51k maybe? As far as the time frame is concerned, according to the public record, MMS had the vehicle for 7 years. So after $50k, 7 years of waiting, AND a lawsuit, the customer got 370 unreliable whp from MMS. Pathetic. In my case it is over 5 years and $7600 for 0 whp. Pathetic again. There are so many things wrong with what you do (and say), I don't know where to start.

Come to think of it, this $50k build/lawsuit thing was going on during the time that I was ordering almost 8k of parts from you. The same parts that you now admit, after 5 years, that you either do not have or refuse to refund in full. The MMS lawsuit should have been disclosed to me at the time of purchase as well, especially since you admitted the profound effect that it had on your business as far as not fulfilling orders just like mine and others as well. MMS posts on 1/16/2020 "Why was MMS slow at developing parts and finishing projects" and gives the 50k build/lawsuit as the ONLY excuse.

MMS-This address I've been asking for, you sit here bitching about time over and over, but you realize I've been asking for the address for the better part of a year right? I mean I don't care really if you don't answer it for another year, I just find it kind of ironic.
---- Like your communications guidelines suggest, " please refrain from swearing." The information requested was sent 6 months ago to MMS btw.

You can refund me for the rest of the parts or you can send me the rest of the parts. The terms are in my last email. Carefully read and comply with those terms. Very simply stated and fair with more fairness shown towards the business than towards the customer in my opinion, especially considering the circumstances involved. If you disagree, kindly explain in detail.

Again, I am very disappointed that you dropped the ball after over 5 years of waiting. My headers were ready to ship by your own admission. My header order status shows awaiting shipment too.
On the bright side, your response times are improving. Not even close to on par with your competitor but an improvement nonetheless. Customers like me that have been waiting 5+ years for goods and services that were supposed to take "6 months" to complete do appreciate being considered somewhat of a priority, that is unless there are MMS customers waiting even longer than that. Hopefully you have a plan in place to turn your business around too. Would be a shame to have even less options for the n-body hobbyist, but since it appears that MMS is not capable of fulfilling paid-up-front orders over 5 years old, or even offering a simple refund on all of those parts either, then the n-body crowd would be better off without you now. MMS had a good reputation years ago. I believe now that MMS is a scam. You are not doing a very good job of proving me wrong so far...