ABS

[3.4 Euro Alero]

Just to stir up the pot once more. Why do you think a company like GM, the first automotive company to offer ABS as standard equipment on virtually all its vehicles in the mid '90's, are in the process of removing ABS as standard equipment? Notice most new models have ABS as an option? Not that it's all that bad, but people don't know how to use it. On slippery roads, I'd prefer it without!

Without ABS they can make base model price cheaper. Comparisons are usually based on base models, it's the only way they can compete with the likes of Kia. It also saves weight, and there are people who don't want it.

[3.4 Euro Alero]

A buddy of mine is a Olds Sales Rep, and "unofficially" GM is currently dropping ABS because of the stats of people rear ending others due to longer breaking distances with ABS. They are explaining it as a price alternative as to not make people worry who have already bought GM vehicles with ABS. The vast majority of people who get in a panic situation lock their arms and hit the brakes, they do not steer around the obstacle as they should. GM just figured since most people do this, why not drop the ABS so that people can stop shorter and likely not run into someones rear end.

If you knew the answer and were so ready to correct me, why did you ask the question? What I've heard from inside GM is that it's a price thing. I'm sure there are many other factors as well.

[3.4 Euro Alero]

Sorry, I wasn't trying to demean and correct you, I was just putting forth the post as a way to make people think about it a little. We all know ABS can be excellent, depending upon the conditions. The letter I personally viewed from GM was explaining how the benefits of ABS really are not being used as they were meant to be, hence the reason it has failed pretty badly to the general public. We have to remember that even though we are younger and most of us have always driven vehicles equipped with ABS, the vast majority of the population drove without it for so long, and were never taught how to use it once it became available. The reason I found out about GM dropping it was that it was not on my new Alero, and it is far from a base model (aside from the braking system, it was top of the line). I know it was standard for many years, so I asked why they would change something like this, especially when Olds was already in its final stages. My dealership is actually recommending people not purchase it unless they really like/want it. Price would be a factor with cheaper cars(Cavalier/Sunfire), but not likely with Alero, Impala, Monte Carlo & Equinox's.

[springs fastest alero]

You lock your wheels and start to slide and it will take longer to stop.
most people get in wrecks with abs because they dont get into the abs enough to realize the pulsating is normal.
abs was for the general public that just slammed on the brakes, locked up the wheels and came sliding into cars with no control. but the general public also lets off the pedal when it starts to kick back at them.
general public cant drive thats why drive by wire, steer by wire, and brake by wire are being worked on. people dont know how to drive so car compaines make cars that drive for them. brake by wire will actually brake harder if needed to avaoid danger.

not everyone wants abs standard and thats why gm is dropping it.

This is the worst thread ever.

3.4 Euro Alero, stop trolling the goddanm thread.

If you wan't to kill ABS and you *INSIST* it's better, keep your lousy opinions and your obvious attempts to sway the opinions of others by insisting that your friend, the "olds sales rep" :rolleyes:, says olds removed it because of shorter stopping distances. Please.

Go ahead and figure out a way to disable ABS, nobody here cares, we're just telling you, like we have many times before, that ABS gives you shorter stopping distances and better control, and thats the goddamn reason why it exists.

Why do you think F1 teams implemented it on their cars? Because it made things more difficult for them? Of course the FIA mandated that they remove ABS and traction control because you might as well have a computer drive the car, but thats neither here nor there.

Get over it.

[3.4 Euro Alero]

Funny how some people absolutely know it all ^ and because they don't like what others say, so they are lousy opinions. Watch Car & Driver once and awhile and see what ABS does in slippery conditions. Shocked the hell out of me! Sorry, I should have been more specific. For Users in the southern US, YES ABS IS BETTER! For the rest of us up NORTH, it is good for the summer, but useless in winter conditions. I really don't care since I have 2 vehicles, 1 with and 1 without. I know how to drive each of them so it's no prob for me. Kinda funny how these guys with say 4 or 5 years of driving experience know it all. Enough said! I'm Done.

^^Dude, you are sounding like arogant know it all, I don't know how many times ABS has saved me in the snow. I used to live in the MI UP and there was stretches where you wouldn't see roads plowed down to pavement for months at a time. I have avoided idiots pulling out of driveways, deer, and other obsticles on the snow because of ABS. I also pull a trailer in the snow, and wouldn't feel comfortable without ABS on my tow vehicle, as I has saved me more than once in a panic stop from another drive not paying attention. Just because you don't understand and cannot opperate a vehicle with ABS, don't go pushing OH ABS is a bad thing, because you are wrong. You probably think smoking crack is good for your health too.

ABS: in the winter it sux, I live in labrador and it's a royal pain in the ass..... the point of ABS is to allow you to slow down and steer out of a possible accident, but for that to work you need traction... on ice... nope not in Labrador.

As for the jamming on the breaks and Hoping for the best ABS sux for that too.... point is to let you steer out of a accident.

Pulling the Fuse Will Disable the ABS and Traction control, but your dash will be lit up like a Christmas tree. I've had to steal the fuse from the ABS to keep my cooling fans going a few times. Didn't cause any trouble for me.

N8tureboy

[3.4 Euro Alero]

Never claimed to be a know-it-all. If you knew how to read, I never said I do NOT like ABS. I prefer not having it in the winter. Kinda getting boring here, so back up your comments with facts, as I will here.

QUOTE: Do cars with ABS stop more quickly than cars without?
Perhaps, but that’s not the main purpose of ABS. It is a system designed to help you maintain control of the vehicle during emergency braking situations, not necessarily make the car stop more quickly. ABS may shorten stopping distances on wet or slippery roads and most systems may shorten stopping distances on dry roads. On very soft surfaces, such as gravel or unpacked snow, ABS may actually lengthen stopping distances. In wet or icy conditions, you should still make sure you drive carefully, always keep a safe distance behind the vehicle in front of you, and maintain a speed consistent with the road conditions. nhtsa.dot.gov

Quote: Do cars with ABS stop more quickly than cars without it?
Not always. Although the stopping distance with ABS is shorter under most road conditions, drivers should always keep a safe distance behind the vehicle in front of them and maintain a speed consistent with the road conditions. While a vehicle with ABS maintains its steering capability in a sudden stop, it may not turn as quickly on a slippery road as it would on dry pavement. abs-education

Quote: Why does the data indicate that ABS fails to reduce accidents?
Safety experts have determined that people do not know how to use ABS effectively when confronted with an emergency situation. Most of the driving populace learned accident-avoidance techniques before ABS was developed. On Sunday, December 17, 1995, the Arizona Republic ran a front page article about a disturbing new insurance trend. USAA, the fifth-largest automobile insurer in the United States, has announced that discounts for vehicles equipped with anti-lock brakes (ABS) will cease, after finding no substantial difference in accident claims between vehicles equipped with ABS and those without ABS.edmunds

Quote: Does ABS reduce stopping distances?
A. Yes, in braking situations where the wheels on a non-ABS equipped vehicle would lock up, ABS will generally provide shorter controlled stopping distance. The amount of improvement in stopping distance depends on many factors, including the road surface, severity of braking, initial vehicle speed, etc. On some surfaces, such as gravel roads, braking distances can be longer, but you will still have the control benefits of ABS. The important capability of ABS is control. ABS provides improved vehicle steerability and stability when braking.
GM Fleet

Also Check out: abs fact index
Canadian Driver.com

Bottom line. ABS IS GREAT IN CERTAIN DRIVING CONDITIONS, BUT NOT OTHERS. KNOW HOW TO DRIVE WITH IT!

[3.4 Euro Alero]

Originally posted by n8tureboy@Jul 20 2004, 07:04 AM
ABS: in the winter it sux, I live in labrador and it's a royal pain in the ass..... the point of ABS is to allow you to slow down and steer out of a possible accident, but for that to work you need traction... on ice... nope not in Labrador.

As for the jamming on the breaks and Hoping for the best ABS sux for that too.... point is to let you steer out of a accident.

Pulling the Fuse Will Disable the ABS and Traction control, but your dash will be lit up like a Christmas tree. I've had to steal the fuse from the ABS to keep my cooling fans going a few times. Didn't cause any trouble for me.

N8tureboy

See, everyone has a different reason for liking it or not. As we are all aware now, ABS works differently for each of us, how we drive and where we drive. Lets all agree to disagree! :cheers: Disputes such as this bring up good points and can educate, such as we have had here, but they should not start fighting. We all joined this site for the same reason, we love Alero's.
Back to the point of this thread, like n8tureboy said, pull the relay, and if the dash bothers you, put a piece of tape on it or pull the lights out as well.