Before I go and drop the money...

Th0r · 05-13-2009, 08:17 AM

Is modding an LD9 mated to an Auto trans even really worth it? With the MP45, secret cams, intake, and header/exaust, would I even expect make it out of the 15's? I can find alot of info on how fast the sticks are going, but not much on autos.

Redog · 05-13-2009, 08:56 AM

What does the LD9 Alero run to start? 16.5?

Cold air Intake, exhaust are a great start.

Cams are always good for power but to set them up right it's a hell of a lot more things that you need than just the cam (or cams) Springs, rods and lifters that complment the cam are needed. Roller rockers don't add HP but free up a lot I read on a 400 HP Ford V8, Roller rockers freed up 31 HP, which is 7.75% a decent gain.

S/C? Ion will say otherwise, but it's a good thing to do. Runs cooler than a turbo and it's instant power, no spool up time, but if you get the right turbo for your car you shouldn't have a long spool time. Tuning is the key when you get to this point. The wrong tune, car will run like shit.

Also on my LA1, the car runs .5 seconds quicker with a totally clear path on a CAI. I remove my fog light and fender liner when I race. You can ask Mitch about that. 2 different days, same conditions (air temp, bomro pressure was .15 different, car weight was 100 heavier on the second time)

14.825 on the first day, 15.454 on the second day. 100 lbs adds one tenth to a 1/4 time, so if the car was 100 heavier on the first run, it would have been 14.92.

cherrington17 · 05-13-2009, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redog

The wrong tune, car will run like shit.

ask jackal about that one.

Th0r · 05-13-2009, 10:16 AM

I'm aware that I need the components to go with cams. Everything I mentioned in my first post is what I'm ready to buy, but now that I'm ready to pull the trigger I really don't want to drop the money if it won't even push it out of the 15's. This is my first go with a 4cyl. Really I was just was wondering if modding an LD9 with an auto trans if worth it, casue I've been told they're quite a bit slower then the 5spd.

Redog · 05-13-2009, 04:08 PM

They aren't that much slower.

Sticks are always cammed higher than thier auto brothers.

Your mod list should drop you into the 15's no problem, I wouldn't be surprised if 14's are a possiblly with that list.

I really think a LD9 guy should chime in, but IMHO, yes 15's are possible with that set-up

05-13-2009, 06:00 PM

If your looking to go fast dont waste your money on the super charger get a turbo.

kwhauck · 05-13-2009, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caboose73

If your looking to go fast dont waste your money on the super charger get a turbo.

says the guy whose car won't run......

05-13-2009, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwhauck

says the guy whose car won't run......

Ya i know im the only guy who can install an oil cooler and cause my car to not start

leoalero · 05-13-2009, 06:31 PM

Man,the only problem i see with this engine is that you cant push enough boost to have fun on a stock internal!But,you can can put light parts and good cams to make your engine breathing better,and a good tune is always the best !

AbHeLlRaZoR · 05-13-2009, 08:15 PM

most anything will make a difference people will argue and tell you this and tell you that. really the final answer comes down to you and what you want to spend, what parts you want, and why you want them. I've been watching a guy on a local forum build his LD9 in his cavalier for over a year now and I'm almost certain that when it's all said and done it will be pushing well over 300hp he says he's aiming for 500hp, I say if it can be done for a Cavalier it can be done for an Alero. I'll let the guys with experience with boost tell you there pro's and cons personally I would be happy with either or, cause a boosted Alero isn't common in my part of Canada.

[ion] C2 · 05-13-2009, 08:24 PM

#1, autos ftw.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redog

Roller rockers don't add HP but free up a lot I read on a 400 HP Ford V8, Roller rockers freed up 31 HP, which is 7.75% a decent gain.

What rockers?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redog

S/C? Ion will say otherwise, but it's a good thing to do. Runs cooler than a turbo and it's instant power, no spool up time, but if you get the right turbo for your car you shouldn't have a long spool time.

Remember I was a big blower advocate...

Runs cooler? What, the turbine housing or the charge air? With the MP45 you cannot intercool it effectively. The air gets heated up, and is no longer of much use. Boost level goes down, temperatures go up, knock occurs.

Realize that when a turbo "spools" at 1800-2200 it's not going to take any longer to make power (MORE power) than a supercharger. When you're WOT, how long do you see under 2 grand?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redog

Also on my LA1, the car runs .5 seconds quicker with a totally clear path on a CAI. I remove my fog light and fender liner when I race. You can ask Mitch about that. 2 different days, same conditions (air temp, bomro pressure was .15 different, car weight was 100 heavier on the second time)

I ran 15.0 to 16.5 with nothing physically changed on my car. Hard to gauge mods vs. time each time you go around the track. Mine was due to heat and wheelspin.

Oh, and yeah, most MP45 powered j-bodies run 13.7-14.5, so you should be able to break out of the 15s. I only did it once.

TheEdgeofSanity · 05-13-2009, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [ion] C2

#1, autos ftw.

auto's nowadays are pretty precise but there is a loss of power and more moving parts to break. its a personal preference and i prefer a manual any day.

Quote:

Originally Posted by [ion] C2

Runs cooler? What, the turbine housing or the charge air? With the MP45 you cannot intercool it effectively. The air gets heated up, and is no longer of much use. Boost level goes down, temperatures go up, knock occurs.

i think he was referring to the two in terms of no add-on cooling equipment. a supercharger would run alot cooler than a turbo engine.

Oldsman · 05-13-2009, 10:42 PM

a LD9 is worth it but do your research and build it right and 14's should bw no problem with the M45 but high 14's to be realistic. Not remember this a turbo would be much more cost effective and the possiblity for 12's is there.

this idea that a stock 2.4 can't handle boost is a lie. a good motor can handle 5-8psi. I have seen a stock motor handle 13psi for awhile.

AbHeLlRaZoR · 05-13-2009, 10:56 PM

I've heard of guys getting away with 8psi on the street and 10psi at the track on stock internals.

GA_turbo · 05-13-2009, 11:07 PM

I ran a 15.8 N/A all i had was HO manifold, throttle body, B&M shift plus, suspension and minor weight reduction ( no spare, no jack, subs, and a 1/4 tank of gas.)

One thing to keep in mind its altitude and baro pressure, you can run a 16 sec run one day and almost a seventeen the next day depending on the weather. Take your car to the track at night you will notice the diference.

Never really compare performance in other vehicles cause it will never be the same.

Also with our cars being as heavy as the are you will rearely see 14s out of a supercharger, 15s all day long unless you gut the crap out of your car.

Boost its fun, you can run 7-8 psi on stock motor, i did for 2 years with no problems, just make sure you have the right component to go with the turbo.
I ran a log style manifold on my car with a 60-1 garret turbo 63/70 ( 63a/r hot side 70a/r cold side) my car ran just fine with it, it spooled right when i want it to and at the dyno at 7 psi i hit 252 whp on stock internals with a stock 9.7:1 compression.

Cheap way for you to run 15s also if you want put a 75 wet nitrous kit and call it a day.

Spilner521 · 05-15-2009, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheEdgeofSanity

auto's nowadays are pretty precise but there is a loss of power and more moving parts to break. its a personal preference and i prefer a manual any day.

I prefer a manual too, but if you're stuck with an auto, you do what you can. Plus, with a tune or B&M shiftplus, it'll shift faster than you or I could ever shift a manual, and it's more consistant at the drag strip.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheEdgeofSanity

i think he was referring to the two in terms of no add-on cooling equipment. a supercharger would run alot cooler than a turbo engine.

No, a supercharger does not run cooler than a turbo. Sure, the turbine housing gets hot, so does your exhaust pipe since the hot exhaust runs through it. A turbo is a more efficient air pump than a roots supercharger. Assuming both compressors running efficient boost levels and neither with an intercooler, the turbo puts out cooler air. Then we can talk about add-on intercoolers to cool the charge further, which you can't do with the supercharger.