Just curious (turbo question)

[sorrowfulkiller]

Back to the oil return line, is the oil pan aluminum? I would check now but I'm in class >_>

Whats the main diference between welding it in and screw the oil return line in? Of course the welded would have less of a chance to leak but will a screwed in one work just as well if it was done properly?

[Cliff8928]

Yes, the oil pan is aluminum.

[Spilner521]

Originally Posted by sorrowfulkiller

Back to the oil return line, is the oil pan aluminum? I would check now but I'm in class >_>

Whats the main diference between welding it in and screw the oil return line in? Of course the welded would have less of a chance to leak but will a screwed in one work just as well if it was done properly?

Like you said, a welded fitting would not leak and you could have a chance of a leak with a screwed in fitting, but as long as you properly wrap the threads with teflon tape, you shouldn't have a problem. The only problem I can see with a screw in fitting would be the oil pan being too thin to properly tap it. I don't know how thick the V6 oil pan is so once again, BlackJack or someone else will have to answer this one.

[kwhauck]

don't know right now but will this weekend.....

[sorrowfulkiller]

btw guys, I found a "incomplete" turbo kit on ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ALL-G...spagenameZWD1V

I'm thinking the price is jacked up a bit because I'm seeing turbos on ebay go for 100-200 and I'm pretty sure that the intercooler tubing won't work with an alero.

If I would buy everything seperately could I get all this for less?

[BlackJack]

disclaimer however, one wrong tweak on the tune, and BOOM.

Also, about the drain fitting. You get a threaded bung, drill the oil pan, weld the bung on, and then screw a fitting into it. I'll see if I can find a pic of it.

[sorrowfulkiller]

I'll be doing the tuning as I go, making sure it accepts the tune well before adding more psi.

I'll probably need some help on tuning though. Since I've never done anything like this before.


I think I know what your talking about, pretty much get a peice with a female screw and weld it onto the oil pan so I could just screw an oil line in?



I picture would be great though

[BlackJack]

dont know. I can tell you this.....no one can "pre-tune" your car accurately. THe more boost you add, the more risk you take, and the more accurately you have to tune.

That's the reason I can't tune your car from where i'm located. I'm at 4,700 feet altitude, and the tune here will not work at your altitude, because the oxygen content of the air at different altitudes is different, where if I tune here and race at sea level, I will run lean (boom). If I tune at sea level and race at altitude, then I will run rich.

[Spilner521]

One of the main reasons I like extra injectors: VERY easy to tune. With the turn of a knob and a glance at the AEM wideband O2 gauge I can adjust how much fuel the extra injectors spray. No base maps to tune or larger injectors that won't idle properly, and when not in boost the engine still runs on stock injectors and stock pcm tune. And if there's any elevation or climate change, I'll see the difference in A/F ratios on the wideband and just turn the knob a little more. Almost too easy.

[sorrowfulkiller]

extra injectors? I've never even heard of anyone using extra injectors... how the hell did you set that up?

[sorrowfulkiller]

nevermind... read up on it, I'd rather change the pcm...

Can I keep factory pcm and use the powertuner or do I have to buy a dhp pcm and then the powertuner?

Will I need a wideband O2 sensor?

How did you tune it blackjack? like did you just figure out at what rpm or throttle position how much fuel you will need or did you go by an A/F gauge, then change the A/F mixture accordingly?

I'm thinking I'll have to tune at a very low psi and work up from there, adding 1-2 psi at a time, correct?
Speaking of, what is a good psi to start to tuning?

[sorrowfulkiller]

You two should seriously make an faq on here for people thinking about turbo applications. Because I'm sure just about all of these questions I'm asking will come up from someone else eventually.

BTW if anyone else is reading this thread, I just bought the book Maximum Boost... i haven't gotten to looking at the book much but it has a huge amount of info. I figured that it would be a good idea to read up on it more.

[Spilner521]

Originally Posted by sorrowfulkiller

nevermind... read up on it, I'd rather change the pcm...

Can I keep factory pcm and use the powertuner or do I have to buy a dhp pcm and then the powertuner?

Will I need a wideband O2 sensor?

How did you tune it blackjack? like did you just figure out at what rpm or throttle position how much fuel you will need or did you go by an A/F gauge, then change the A/F mixture accordingly?

I'm thinking I'll have to tune at a very low psi and work up from there, adding 1-2 psi at a time, correct?
Speaking of, what is a good psi to start to tuning?

In order to tune it yourself you'll need to know how much fuel is going into the engine at any given moment, so yes you'll need a wideband. Just start at the wastegate boost pressure so you get an idea of what you're doing then add boost from there with a boost controller, adding fuel at the same time. Just keep an eye on the wideband A/F gauge. It's better to run a little too rich at first than too lean. Right now, as soon as the turbo spools, my extra injector setup holds a very consistant 11.7:1 all the way to redline. This is considered a good, safe A/F ratio in boost. But remember, wth the larger injectors you'll still need to tune them to run 14.7:1 out of boost.

And I'm just curious...why would you rather change the pcm than use extra injectors?

[Spilner521]

Originally Posted by sorrowfulkiller

You two should seriously make an faq on here for people thinking about turbo applications. Because I'm sure just about all of these questions I'm asking will come up from someone else eventually.

BTW if anyone else is reading this thread, I just bought the book Maximum Boost... i haven't gotten to looking at the book much but it has a huge amount of info. I figured that it would be a good idea to read up on it more.

I wouldn't mind at all contributing to a turbo FAQ. I didn't know anything when I started and I taught myself pretty much everything. It'd be nice for other guys (or girls) to have something to start from if they're serious about going turbo.

Maximum Boost...lots of good info. I don't own it but I've read through it a few times. It's perfect for understanding all the parts of a turbo system and how they all work together to make power.

[BlackJack]

ok, back to the oil return drain line and how the bung is welded in.

Here's a pic that shows where it is welded in, and the fitting threaded in:

[sorrowfulkiller]

Originally Posted by Spilner521

And I'm just curious...why would you rather change the pcm than use extra injectors?

Well for one I'm much more comfortable with changing things via a computer, been working with them most of my life, so something like editing a PCM should come fairly easy to me.... whereas adding injectors is gray area to me... I have no clue how I would manage flow or exactly how they work... but right now I'm completely open to any ideas and I'd really like to hear your setup works and how it runs.

If you could explain to me how it works that would be awesome. Like for instance what would be needed, where one would put the 7th injector, how to control the flow from it, ect...

I've heard of such things on older buick regals like the 1988 with the turbo, where the 7th injector also cooled the setup because it introduced the gas which acted to cool the air coming into the engine while also adding gas when the turbo was runing, is that pretty much the same concept that you have going on your car?

[sorrowfulkiller]

Originally Posted by BlackJack

ok, back to the oil return drain line and how the bung is welded in.

Here's a pic that shows where it is welded in, and the fitting threaded in

Thanks a lot for the image, I really never knew it'd be that easy to do... drill, weld, screw xD Perfect place for it though since it's right by the filter, atleast then you can check for leaks when you change oil.

[sorrowfulkiller]

Alright what about detonation blackjack? did you experience detonation at all (ie knocking) before you tuned? What about while you tuned? Did you just retard ignition timing a couple degrees if you heard it and left the timing at that?

What about injectors, if I'm going for a max of 12 psi, what size would I be looking at here? I want to get the maximum power out of that 12 psi.

[BlackJack]

at 12psi, you'll need 42.5# injectors.
yes I got KR like mad, and no, I got rid of most of it by adding fuel first, tightening stuff on the engine second, upgraded my fuel octane, and then what very tiny amound of KR was left I tuned out by timing.

[sorrowfulkiller]

Does dhp power tuner allow for realtime scanning for kr then?