01-06-2008, 05:18 PM
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#1
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GX Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 28
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Need Some Help
Okay.. So here are the basics, I have a 2001 2.4L with a WAI and pacestter header with the full 2.5in cat back system. I also put on a magnaflow high flow cat. Everything was fine until the rear O2 sensor went out. The car threw a code and started stumbling really bad. So I read the code and found out that the sensor went bad, so I replaced it. The code cleared, but the stumbling continued. I figured that it would hopefully smooth back out. Then about a week later it threw another code, this time for the cat. So i had it temp tested and it wasn't firing. I then pulled it off to find it full of carbon, really bad. It seems like I have been running really rich and it fouled the cat. So I need some help finding out why it is running so rich, and if this is what's causing the stumbling. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
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01-06-2008, 08:06 PM
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#2
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GL Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: las vegas
Posts: 578
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabear
Okay.. So here are the basics, I have a 2001 2.4L with a WAI and pacestter header with the full 2.5in cat back system. I also put on a magnaflow high flow cat. Everything was fine until the rear O2 sensor went out. The car threw a code and started stumbling really bad. So I read the code and found out that the sensor went bad, so I replaced it. The code cleared, but the stumbling continued. I figured that it would hopefully smooth back out. Then about a week later it threw another code, this time for the cat. So i had it temp tested and it wasn't firing. I then pulled it off to find it full of carbon, really bad. It seems like I have been running really rich and it fouled the cat. So I need some help finding out why it is running so rich, and if this is what's causing the stumbling. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
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check your plugs to see what they look like...., could be fouled plug, bad coil pack, could be map sensor related, could be front o2 sensor related................make sure you don't have vacuum leaks.........
start w/ that.
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01-06-2008, 08:42 PM
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#3
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GX Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: minnesota
Posts: 178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabear
Okay.. So here are the basics, I have a 2001 2.4L with a WAI and pacestter header with the full 2.5in cat back system. I also put on a magnaflow high flow cat. Everything was fine until the rear O2 sensor went out. The car threw a code and started stumbling really bad. So I read the code and found out that the sensor went bad, so I replaced it. The code cleared, but the stumbling continued. I figured that it would hopefully smooth back out. Then about a week later it threw another code, this time for the cat. So i had it temp tested and it wasn't firing. I then pulled it off to find it full of carbon, really bad. It seems like I have been running really rich and it fouled the cat. So I need some help finding out why it is running so rich, and if this is what's causing the stumbling. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
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Well here is the thing now that you have the high flow cat your exhaust velocity increased and to top it all up, you went from a manifold that had the 02 sensor reading all cylinders to a header that only reads 1 cylinder. The sensor in the cat doesnt affect performance it just tells the computer that the cat is working, if your cat now is stright thru the o2 sensor in the cat is always goin to fry faster now cause now is reading higher temps that the sensor cant handel.
One thing you can do is wire your own heated o2 sensor for the o2 on the header and this will solve your running rich problem since the o2 sensor thats on your car right now is taking forever to heat up from only one cylinder, thats why you are running rich plus you are only reading one cylinder AFR.
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01-07-2008, 12:44 AM
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#4
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GX Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 28
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Well I replaced both of the O2 sensors at the same time, about 2 months ago, and the front O2 sensor is in the collector pipe so it should be getting all 4 cylinders, right? Also I just replaced the plug about 5 months ago with Bosc platinum 4's. And i just checked all the vac lines and it all looks good. And I didn't think the 2.4 had a MAP sensor only an IAT and that i think is okay..
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01-07-2008, 12:55 AM
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#5
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Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Long Grove, IL
Posts: 5,002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabear
Also I just replaced the plug about 5 months ago with Bosc platinum 4's.
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That's the first mistake. Waste-Spark ignition systems typically don't work good with bosch platinum series plugs.
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Cliff Scott
2004 Alero GX w/sport pkg - Sold, living somewhere in WI now.
2011 Saab 9-5 Turbo4 M6
2004 Corvette Convertible M6
1994 Chevy Beretta - Quad4/M5
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01-07-2008, 02:15 PM
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#6
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GX Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 28
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Really? What plugs should I change to?
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01-07-2008, 03:47 PM
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#7
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Trying To Help
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: MICHIGAN
Posts: 509
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Ac Delcos
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03 OLDS ALERO
MODS: MSD WIRES,CAI, CUSTOM CARGRILLS, B&M SHIFTPLUS,PRIMAX WHEELS,WHITE GAUGE FACES,8000k Hids
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01-07-2008, 04:21 PM
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#8
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GL Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Loring, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 579
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ya man the stock ac delco are pretty good
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2003 Alero
2.2 5speed
Grey
1996 GMC Yukon 4x4
5.7 liters of gas suckin power!
33x12.5r15 Mud Terrians on 15x10 wheels
111,111,111 x 111,111,111 = 12345678987654321
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01-07-2008, 05:06 PM
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#9
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GX Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 59
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i like my NGK's personally... and they arent very expensive.
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01-07-2008, 05:29 PM
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#10
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GX Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: minnesota
Posts: 178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliff8928
That's the first mistake. Waste-Spark ignition systems typically don't work good with bosch platinum series plugs.
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X 2 dont run bosch at alll........... never. Run some autolites youll be fine.
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01-08-2008, 12:59 AM
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#11
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GX Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 28
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Okay, I will change the plugs tomorrow.. Hopefully that will help.
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01-08-2008, 08:41 AM
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#12
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GLS member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Missouri
Posts: 1,442
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GA_turbo
X 2 dont run bosch at alll........... never. Run some autolites youll be fine.
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autolites all the way.
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01-08-2008, 09:21 AM
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#13
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Trying To Help
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: MICHIGAN
Posts: 509
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i know that i said this before people buying nkg plugs are buying the samething as ac delcos
look at a ac delco and it has stamped on the metal part ngk
plus also has stamped the gm part number
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03 OLDS ALERO
MODS: MSD WIRES,CAI, CUSTOM CARGRILLS, B&M SHIFTPLUS,PRIMAX WHEELS,WHITE GAUGE FACES,8000k Hids
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01-08-2008, 01:07 PM
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#14
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Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Long Grove, IL
Posts: 5,002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CBLOHM3400
i know that i said this before people buying nkg plugs are buying the samething as ac delcos
look at a ac delco and it has stamped on the metal part ngk
plus also has stamped the gm part number
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I think that's only the iridium plugs that are made by NGK for ACDelco.
__________________
Cliff Scott
2004 Alero GX w/sport pkg - Sold, living somewhere in WI now.
2011 Saab 9-5 Turbo4 M6
2004 Corvette Convertible M6
1994 Chevy Beretta - Quad4/M5
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01-08-2008, 03:51 PM
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#15
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GL Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: las vegas
Posts: 578
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NGK for the win.
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Trevtec Motorsports built & driven - LV,NV
Revolution Lounge @ the Mirage
Promoter - PM me to be put on the list. Ladies first drink free wed, thur, sat
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01-08-2008, 08:13 PM
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#16
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GX Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 28
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Okay.. So I went with the NGK Iridium IX.. It seems to be doing a little better, but I can still tell there is something wrong, still a slight trembling, and it just threw the Cat code again.
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01-08-2008, 09:04 PM
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#17
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GL Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: las vegas
Posts: 578
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabear
Okay.. So I went with the NGK Iridium IX.. It seems to be doing a little better, but I can still tell there is something wrong, still a slight trembling, and it just threw the Cat code again.
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How many miles on car, have you had your injectors cleaned lately? Have you had your coil packs checked out at all?
__________________
CARDOMAIN W/ DRAG VID & LIST OF MODS
Trevtec Motorsports built & driven - LV,NV
Revolution Lounge @ the Mirage
Promoter - PM me to be put on the list. Ladies first drink free wed, thur, sat
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01-08-2008, 09:08 PM
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#18
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Boost Guru
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 1,837
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What is the number that comes up when the code is read? That would help us help you.
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01-08-2008, 09:25 PM
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#19
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GX Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 28
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It's a 420 code, cat Inefficiency. It has 84000mi and I have run injector cleaner through it about every 5000mi or so. I haven't had the coils checked yet, I wanted to get some opinions before I spend $100 for a diagnostic.
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01-11-2008, 01:25 PM
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#20
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GX Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 28
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Okay.. So i got the diagnostic this morning. They said the main issue is that the upstream O2 sensor isn't heating up enough and that's causing it to run too rich. They said that the Bosch sensor that I just installed isn't good for the header and exhaust setup. They suggested that I go with a Delphi sensor and that should fix it. Also they said that the fan is turning on low sometimes when the car is cold. They said it shouldn't turn on until the operating temp, which is like 220, is reached. Its not always, but it might also be causing it to run to cold, which would cause it to run rich. I was wondering if any one has any input on this, or if any one has had similar issues? Any suggestions would be awesome.
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