How Much Power Can The Stock Auto Take?

[Alero2k4]

I mean like daily driver power not just at the strip. I am seriously looking into boosting it and that is the weak point on these cars (beside rods and pistons). I searched and didn't come up with anything.

[-Alero-]

300 i believe

[Alero2k4]

And while were on the topic of trannies, I saw over on J-body, that people who had the b&m shiftplus and the auto trans had real problems when they took them off. The trans would slip way too much...any one here ever taken one off after having it on for 6 or more months? It may just be the different trans???

[-Alero-]

Originally posted by Alero2k4@Jan 26 2006, 08:52 PM
And while were on the topic of trannies, I saw over on J-body, that people who had the b&m shiftplus and the auto trans had real problems when they took them off. The trans would slip way too much...any one here ever taken one off after having it on for 6 or more months? It may just be the different trans???
Quoted post



no those people are Shloobs, because with the B&M shiftplus you have the option to have it off on setting one or setting 2.

what they did was probably left it on setting 1, which in time with city driving is bad for the clutches and gears. setting 2 is even harder.

i have the B&M shiftplus, and the only time i have used it was wwhen i need it which is close to never. for daily driving it is not needed at all.

after a while of driving with the shift kit on setting 1 or 2, the transmission goes through alot of stress, and in time, wears down the clutches and gears too where they can only function with the shiftkit on, and cannot shift or work in the stock setting.

[-Alero-]

thats all, its really just one of those things you use every once and a while, like in a drag race.

[Redog]

Tranny is pretty much bulletproof, but I cracked mine like an egg

I believe it's 280 ft lbs is the max, I'll look it up later

[2fst4u]

are you sure about your info? the crap about the b&m being hard on a tranny. i've always heard that its easier on the clutches.
who knows

[eag182]

215lbft according to what I have

[Fast Eddie]

Originally posted by 2fst4u@Jan 27 2006, 12:38 AM
are you sure about your info? the crap about the b&m being hard on a tranny. i've always heard that its easier on the clutches.
who knows
Quoted post

tru dat. Higher pressures means quicker shifts, which mean less stress on the internals.

[-Alero-]

Originally posted by Fast Eddie+Jan 27 2006, 04:42 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Fast Eddie @ Jan 27 2006, 04:42 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-2fst4u@Jan 27 2006, 12:38 AM
are you sure about your info?Â;-) the crap about the b&m being hard on a tranny.Â;-) i've always heard that its easier on the clutches.
who knows
Quoted post

tru dat. Higher pressures means quicker shifts, which mean less stress on the internals.
Quoted post
[/b][/quote]


then its the gears my bad

[SweetNLow]

i had an autotrans in my car for awhile and then took it out. never had any problems.

[Alero2k4]

K...well I would really like to run more than that. What do I need to do to it to get it to handle more power. I am thinking 300+. Even if it involves a tranny swap. However, keep in mind, the cheaper the better (as in not going too overboard, I am not willing to take shortcuts and risk having to redo stuff).

[doubleN0alero]

how areyou planning on getting at 300+?

[eag182]

let him take care of that, its good he's considering the tranny before any real mods. There is a TON of tranny info over at GRANDAMGT.com. There's a user there thats pushing 350lbft of torque and he's had a lot of tranny work done. His username is tehjohnson and I think he's has a DPP Turbo. There are threads over there about beefing up our trannys. I would join that forum and do some searching.

about a swap, I don't think thats realistic. There was discussion over at gagt and a couple people were talking about the tranny on the supercharged GP, but I'd do a search on that.

[Oldsman]

the one thing the B&M and auto interceptor does is increase the temp of your tranny fluid.

[kwhauck]

Originally posted by eag182@Jan 27 2006, 03:49 PM
let him take care of that, its good he's considering the tranny before any real mods. There is a TON of tranny info over at GRANDAMGT.com. There's a user there thats pushing 350lbft of torque and he's had a lot of tranny work done. His username is tehjohnson and I think he's has a DPP Turbo. There are threads over there about beefing up our trannys. I would join that forum and do some searching.

about a swap, I don't think thats realistic. There was discussion over at gagt and a couple people were talking about the tranny on the supercharged GP, but I'd do a search on that.
Quoted post


negative, he did it himself, it is no kit or anything, he fabbed it up almost 100% by himself..

[eag182]

100%? I though he "collaberated". Isn't that his dyno on DPP's site?

[Alero2k4]

Originally posted by double0alero+Jan 27 2006, 01:13 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(double0alero @ Jan 27 2006, 01:13 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>how areyou planning on getting at 300+?
Quoted post
[/b]

Are you serious??? :blink: I could go on for days about how I plan to do it... :biggrin: TURBO+Boost controller to start it off, then eventually a standalone ems, head work with valve train, possibly even nos, let's put it this way, I won't stop in my quest for more power. BUT before the standalone and all that garbage, I need to have a trans built up strong enough, as a matter of fact, that is priority numero uno. Besides I don't want to have to worry about it when I am driving around screwin off and racin' people etc...tempermental stuff sux, :thumbsdown: and I don't want to worry about it since I definately won't be 'kittyfooting around' (I love that quote...lol) :lol:

<!--QuoteBegin-eag182@Jan 27 2006, 02:49 PM
let him take care of that, its good he's considering the tranny before any real mods. There is a TON of tranny info over at GRANDAMGT.com. There's a user there thats pushing 350lbft of torque and he's had a lot of tranny work done. His username is tehjohnson and I think he's has a DPP Turbo. There are threads over there about beefing up our trannys. I would join that forum and do some searching.

about a swap, I don't think thats realistic. There was discussion over at gagt and a couple people were talking about the tranny on the supercharged GP, but I'd do a search on that.
Quoted post
[/quote]

Thanks, i will check it out. I joined and started searching over there, but I can'd find that user name or auto trans build ups...

[doubleN0alero]

didnt john have some issues mixing nos with engine work?

[Spilner521]

Originally posted by Alero2k4@Jan 27 2006, 07:51 PM
Are you serious??? :blink: I could go on for days about how I plan to do it... :biggrin: TURBO+Boost controller to start it off, then eventually a standalone ems, head work with valve train, possibly even nos, let's put it this way, I won't stop in my quest for more power. BUT before the standalone and all that garbage, I need to have a trans built up strong enough, as a matter of fact, that is priority numero uno. Besides I don't want to have to worry about it when I am driving around screwin off and racin' people etc...tempermental stuff sux, :thumbsdown: and I don't want to worry about it since I definately won't be 'kittyfooting around' (I love that quote...lol) :lol:


its a lot easier to talk about making 300+ HP than actually doing it. dont get me wrong....it can and has been done (on cavaliers), buts its not as easy as you make it sound. besides your turbo, head work, standalone and tranny, you'll need an efficient charge pipe setup and intercooler, a good quality turbo exhaust manifold and free flowing exhaust at least 3" in diameter, as well as all forged internals. it'll take a lot of time, money and tons of research to get everything to work properly, but it can be done. this will be one helluva setup when its all done with....just realize it will take some time. get boosted :thumb:

[BlackJack]

username you're looking for is tejohnson. misspelled it probably didn't come up on searches.

dont let anyone fool you, the 4t45 can be built to handle quite a bit.

Danny's Transmissions, Killeen TX can build em to poke about 500+hp down the track, and say's he'll do it for ~2500 (your tranny).

but for that money, I can get a ZZP/Certified 4t65HD.

[eag182]

i doubt there is any alero with a 65hd





but please, prove me wrong

[Fast Eddie]

Originally posted by Alero2k4+Jan 27 2006, 06:51 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Alero2k4 @ Jan 27 2006, 06:51 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-double0alero@Jan 27 2006, 01:13 PM
how areyou planning on getting at 300+?
Quoted post


Are you serious??? :blink: I could go on for days about how I plan to do it... :biggrin: TURBO+Boost controller to start it off, then eventually a standalone ems, head work with valve train, possibly even nos, let's put it this way, I won't stop in my quest for more power. BUT before the standalone and all that garbage, I need to have a trans built up strong enough, as a matter of fact, that is priority numero uno. Besides I don't want to have to worry about it when I am driving around screwin off and racin' people etc...tempermental stuff sux, :thumbsdown: and I don't want to worry about it since I definately won't be 'kittyfooting around' (I love that quote...lol) :lol:
Quoted post
[/b][/quote]
Are you Serious?? building a drivetrain that was not built to take that much power/abuse is bound to be tempremental. Just ask nguyen, springs, or the couple others that are even close.

[Alero2k4]

Maybe I'll get lucky and they will post.

[SilverBullet256]

Originally posted by eag182@Jan 27 2006, 04:49 PM
let him take care of that, its good he's considering the tranny before any real mods. There is a TON of tranny info over at GRANDAMGT.com. There's a user there thats pushing 350lbft of torque and he's had a lot of tranny work done. His username is tehjohnson and I think he's has a DPP Turbo. There are threads over there about beefing up our trannys. I would join that forum and do some searching.

about a swap, I don't think thats realistic. There was discussion over at gagt and a couple people were talking about the tranny on the supercharged GP, but I'd do a search on that.
Quoted post




well if you guys were to pay attention, then you would realise one thing, ted johnsons turbo is on a 3400 v-6, our friend here has a 2.2 ecotec, so its a little different, and just a tad bit harder to get that much power out of the ecotec

[BlackJack]

Originally posted by eag182@Feb 1 2006, 09:26 PM
i doubt there is any alero with a 65hd
but please, prove me wrong
Quoted post

not that I know of either, YET. But just hold on to your panties and keep an eye out during this race season, you'll see one soon enough.

what's the late model Impala running? yes, I do believe it's a factory 3400/4t65 by golly.

[-Alero-]

Originally posted by BlackJack+Feb 2 2006, 08:49 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(BlackJack @ Feb 2 2006, 08:49 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-eag182@Feb 1 2006, 09:26 PM
i doubt there is any alero with a 65hd
but please, prove me wrong
Quoted post

not that I know of either, YET. But just hold on to your panties and keep an eye out during this race season, you'll see one soon enough.

what's the late model Impala running? yes, I do believe it's a factory 3400/4t65 by golly.
Quoted post
[/b][/quote]


dont forget the monte.

gah i forget what tranny the chevy venture had :(

[eag182]

Originally posted by BlackJack+Feb 2 2006, 08:49 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(BlackJack @ Feb 2 2006, 08:49 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-eag182@Feb 1 2006, 09:26 PM
i doubt there is any alero with a 65hd
but please, prove me wrong
Quoted post

not that I know of either, YET. But just hold on to your panties and keep an eye out during this race season, you'll see one soon enough.

what's the late model Impala running? yes, I do believe it's a factory 3400/4t65 by golly.
Quoted post
[/b][/quote]


interesting

[Alero2k4]

Originally posted by SilverBullet256@Feb 2 2006, 05:54 PM
well if you guys were to pay attention, then you would realise one thing, ted johnsons turbo is on a 3400 v-6, our friend here has a 2.2 ecotec, so its a little different, and just a tad bit harder to get that much power out of the ecotec
Quoted post


More boost.... Now did all Alero's come with the 4t45e? Please just don't tell me I have the 40...

[SilverBullet256]

well you need to remember that there are different drive train setups on the aleros, i believe the 4 bangers have the 40 i think, or i dont think they have the same tranny anyway, the bolt pattern isnt the same cause then alot more people would be trying to drop in a manual on the 3400's because you could just take all the parts out of the 4 cyl alero's, so no i dont think they all have the same tranny, it matters on the motor


o and its not as easy to just add more boost, you need to figure out the equation on how much boost you need to create the amount of power you want, based starting on how much power you begin with before boost determins how many
atmospheres you need to push into the engine, and the earth itself provides on atmosphere of pressure to a stock engine, and one atmosphere equals roughly 14 lbs of air per inch(not sure if square or cubic, cant remember), and if i remember correctly the stock ecotecs have 145 hp, so to get 300 to the crank, you will need to have over 15 lbs of boost, and you cant exactly just add that kind of boost to an engine without doing an intense and i mean an intense buildup, thats if you want it to run correctly and for a good amount of time, so the answer isnt as simple as more boost

[Alero2k4]

I understand it all. I grew up in a shop which my dad now owns and I spent my childhood there :heehee: getting kicked out of school has it's perks.... I am looking at everything from block all the way to the tires. It will include: Full balance of the engine, con rods, lower compression pistons, high pressure copper head gasket, arp studs, ported head, performance valvetrain including cams, timing chain, and gears, intake manifold, larger throttle body, intercooler, full mandrel bent tubing, super16 or t3/t4 hybrid turbo with external wastegate and I'm sure there is more I am forgetting. I am not willing to cut ANY corners with this and thus it will wait until I have all of the money I need in order to get it done right... I am also looking at the same attention to detail for the transmission and even the brake and electrical systems. Trust me, I understand what a project like this takes (In thought, money, and time). :cool: I also understand that in order to accomplish everything I want I am looking at probably close to 15 grand in mods(this includes all exterior mods as well, as I will be doing all the work I can myself...pretty much everything). I am just going to take it one step at a time, but the first step is the transmission.

[doubleN0alero]

for 15 grand, you should just get a sti and get your 300 hp...and build from there...

[Alero2k4]

Originally posted by double0alero@Feb 3 2006, 06:39 PM
for 15 grand, you should just get a sti and get your 300 hp...and build from there...
Quoted post


I personally prefer to be different. I am not looking for something to run 10's just something really nice that looks great that is DIFFERENT and is fast enough to shut most people up. Besides, an STI wouldn't be hard to make fast...I sort of like the challenge...

[Alero2k4]

Originally posted by Fast Eddie@Feb 2 2006, 09:00 AM
Are you Serious?? building a drivetrain that was not built to take that much power/abuse is bound to be tempremental. Just ask nguyen, springs, or the couple others that are even close.
Quoted post


Before I forget....that is why I will build it to take the power/abuse...

[Spilner521]

Originally posted by SilverBullet256@Feb 3 2006, 08:10 PM
o and its not as easy to just add more boost, you need to figure out the equation on how much boost you need to create the amount of power you want, based starting on how much power you begin with before boost determins how many
atmospheres you need to push into the engine, and the earth itself provides on atmosphere of pressure to a stock engine, and one atmosphere equals roughly 14 lbs of air per inch(not sure if square or cubic, cant remember), and if i remember correctly the stock ecotecs have 145 hp, so to get 300 to the crank, you will need to have over 15 lbs of boost, and you cant exactly just add that kind of boost to an engine without doing an intense and i mean an intense buildup, thats if you want it to run correctly and for a good amount of time, so the answer isnt as simple as more boost
Quoted post


its not only boost pressure you have to figure out, but the size of the turbo and how much air is flowing at that much pressure. a t25 turbo at 10psi wont flow nearly as much air as a t3/t4 at 10 psi. you'll have to look at compresser maps and figure out which turbo will flow enough air at a certain psi to get the power you want, but also stay within the efficiency range of that turbo.

[eag182]

When is tejohnson gonna give his opinion here

[SilverBullet256]

well he gave his oppinion on the other thread abouthow to install an sc, he made a challenge to a race i believe

[Alero2k4]

K...just so everyone knows this is not something that will be happening too soon. Unless there is a big change in my life, then th efunding won't support it until later this year.... It is looking like early next year I will have all the money and resources researched and set up. This was originally set up as a 'feeler' to see if it is really even possible to do, and what I would be looking at. After it is complete I would have no problem racing anyone who wanted to challenge.

[Fast Eddie]

Originally posted by Alero2k4+Feb 3 2006, 08:36 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Alero2k4 @ Feb 3 2006, 08:36 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-Fast Eddie@Feb 2 2006, 09:00 AM
Are you Serious?? building a drivetrain that was not built to take that much power/abuse is bound to be tempremental. Just ask nguyen, springs, or the couple others that are even close.
Quoted post


Before I forget....that is why I will build it to take the power/abuse...
Quoted post
[/b][/quote]
So did they. Still tempramental.

[Alero2k4]

:( That's no good, sounds like a 1000 backup car and some extra money may be necessary as well...

[Fast Eddie]

whooooa there money bags. you can pick up a good early 90's Q4 for a couple hundred. if it ain't a donor its an alternative ;)

[Alero2k4]

I meant 1k or less... Not money bags yet...but should be next year.