Turbo/supercharger Question

[wy3134]

Being brought up about using spare parts off engines at junk yards for possible PnP, would it be possible to use those parts for turbo/supercharger applications, like say taking them to a shop and having them PnP and other things? or are the materials just too weak in a stock engine for a strong turbo/supercharger application?

[bdyman]

from the research i have done our block can handle allot of abuse
the hahn turbo set up put`s out if i remember correctly close to 12 psi and a stock ecotec block will handle it

[wy3134]

ok i think i have a better grasp of what i wanted to ask, would a PnP be a good thing to do towards a turbo setup if im plannin on running over 10psi boost?

[wy3134]

main reason im looking for alternatives is those patriot heads are nice but I dont exactly wanna throw down $1400 if I can just get a set of heads and have them worked on, but still looking to eventually run 10+psi boost

[bdyman]

with a turbo you need to improve on air and fuel flow
so ya p&p head is a good thing with a turbo

[AleroSS]

On the topic of A/F flow, and Turbos and our engines, what PSI level would you say would be a safe level to run up to until Fuel mods were done. If I wanted to run 4-6, non intercooled with a T3, would I need to up the size of the injectors or add a FPR/AFPR? I had been wondering this from a LONG time ago, and especially now that I found out how LEAN our cars run, both at idle, and all across the charts (14.4 A/F Ratio - UBER LEAN), but this was back when my plans actually included a TC on the car and not like what I have currently planned... Good luck, and hope my wrecker idea works for ya dude :thumbsup:

[havik]

or are the materials just too weak in a stock engine for a strong turbo/supercharger application?

While you've probably seen it already, here's a good article that provides a graph of when materials failed
http://www.year2032.com/ecotec.htm

[wy3134]

thanks havik, i had lost that link and couldnt find it.

[geedog66]

from what i read a while ago the stock connecting rods cant handle anything more than around 280 hp so i plan on gettin a crate engine through jbodyperformance before i put a turbo on my car..

[wy3134]

whats better about a crate engine? whats the price on one of those? let us know, theres gonna be some on here that would be interested to know

['04 aler-ho]

yeah a crate is just a fatory engine. find saab parts

[geedog66]

no the create engine im gettin is built up its not a stock replacement i wouldnt wanna replace my engine for the samething its not worth it i want more not the same... see the crate engine has everything performance plus a 5 angle valve job... check the site out and got to the machine shop section youll see what im talking about....

[wy3134]

Mind i ask a ballpark figure of what its costing for that engine w/ everything your having done, Geedog? After looking over that page, I dont know why i looked anywhere else. Seems as if I can go almost anywhere on what I want. Just a matter of figuring out the setup I want/need (of course is the hardest part to any project :lol: )

[AleroSS]

If your plans for a Turbo are to start with low level boost and work your way up from there, I really would reconsider the crate engine WY3134. Basically, your stock engine will be able to handle up to the 283 hp breaking point. Keep it safe and maybe just go to 250 or 260 chp, and with a PnP (Port n Polish with a 5 angle or even 3 angle valve job) you'll definitely be gettin some gains over a stock head. Unless you have a great deal of coin, I really discourage the crate engine, I find that you learn more in the way of building up your own engine rather than buying one already built for you. Thats kinda like saying would you rather buy a complete tuner car, or build one on your own? Id rather do it on my own...

[wy3134]

My goal is a turbo, and I agree to learn the process, but at the same time I dont have the biggest budget, are you far along on your project alero? I still have a while before I start putting mods on the engine cause of it still being under the extended warranty, and trying to figure out a rough estimate of building the engine up and all for an eventual turbo and my goal is to be able to run boost upwards of 12-15 in the next couple of years, im just kinda stuck on finding some of the more obsolete parts to the engine.

[geedog66]

well the reason why i want that crate engine is because 280 is not enough for me i want at least 350 hp to the wheels that will make me happy and the rods arent rated that high so i might as well replace it... to me it will cost me more for someone to replace the internals for example the head kit that they have which comes with 5 angle vave job cams, cam gears, pistons, valve and some more stuff i cant think of now but id get all that plus rods and bearings the head kit cost around 2800 dollars minus shipping then another 600 dollar for the rods and whatever the bearing cost... then i would have to find some to do all the work of tearing down the engine then replacing all the parts... or i can get the crate engine for 3800 dollars and have everything replaced form the other kit plus more... then all i would have to do is have someone switch out engines which would also take less time to do... so just ask yourself around where do you your car to preform get only around 80 hp or do you want more... i said more and that requires internal work done to the engine... thats why im getting the crate engine turbo is in mind but like i said 80 hp increase will not make me happy im getting a complete turbo kit custom made to get my expected horsepower goal...

[wy3134]

any ideas what that crate engine can handle in terms of power, granted u go with the piston and rod upgrades and 5 angle valve job and other odds n ends? ive got a goal in mind but a budget that will dictate how much power i can actually afford

[wy3134]

after looking through that page, thats a heck of a deal they offer there on the upgrades, as nothing is too expensive and sounds like they can customize it to a turbo setup or NA setup, and the $1000 core refund is really intriguing. Hmm I may contact them just to find out if they know what kind of power limits it has with all the upgrades.

[wy3134]

I didnt think of it till now, would any company out there be able to do a custom tune for this engine? I know the stock ECU would be worthless w/ this engine.

[geedog66]

on one of the pages it talks about using a stand alone fuel management system to control this setup the best way to get the best results out of the engine

[wy3134]

ahh ok, something else I have forgotten to read into, thanks!

['04 aler-ho]

here is some stuff you guys might like. the first part of the #'s are 8895****. where the *** are put the # next to the part there. example for the block 88958630.

block - 8630
head cnc - 8619
race pistons - 8634
rods - 8618
head gasket and o ring - 8614
blank cams - 8611 + 8612
performance cams(dur. 268 lift 464 lobe center 232) - 8648
cam gears - 8613
balancer - 8615
billet crank - 8620
puilley - 8631
75 mm ls1 intake - 8629
header flange kit(to make your own) - 8632
DVD how to build a 1000 hp ecotec - 8647



all these #s are courtesy of gm parts catalog

[wy3134]

I found their website, however didnt know they had that much avail. Would be nice if they gave some prices on their site instead of having to call them for a quote <_<

[havik]

Good work '04 aler-ho

['04 aler-ho]

apparently gm is very proud of these parts. i was at the dealership today gettin some warranty stuff done today and checked some prices. the blank cams are 110 a pc. race cams are 700. cam gears are almost 500. header flange is 100. i literally laughed in the guys face.

he asked "why are you laughing?"

i said "i can get custom stuff from crower and je cheaper than that."

he said "it'll void your warranty"

i "if i putt this stuff from gm in it will it void my warranty?"

him "if your motor breaks it wont be covered"

i gazed at him with a blank stare and walked away

[wy3134]

Jeez, although it explains why they are coming out w/ their supercharged engine for the 2.2L applications (not the 2.0L destroked version), cause they cant find enough retards out there to buy their performance parts. I will stick to custom stuff instead of looking into buying GM.