Got the Leak (UPDATE 2-25-04)

[3.4Alero]

Well, I changed my oil after work tonight, and when I took the filler cap off, there was white milky crap on the bottom of the cap. :pissed: I really thought I would be one of the lucky ones that didn't get the intake manifold gasket leak, but I guess not. There will be some hell to pay though. Just before my warranty was up, my coolant light came on. So I took it in and told them to specifically check since there is a history of the gaskets goin bad. They SAID they pressure tested the system and all was well, but coolant does not just dissappear. I know there is some degree of evaporation, but not like this was! So I told them I wanted documentation of the whole situation, so that if it happened again, I could prove the symptoms started under warranty. So I'll start at the dealership, and if I have no luck there, then I'll give GM a call.

:angry: :angry: :angry:

[johny_boy32]

at least you cought it and it will be on the RO for documentation also...hope it doesnt happen to me

[brsexton]

Originally posted by johny_boy32@Jan 29 2004, 08:31 PM
at least you cought it and it will be on the RO for documentation also...hope it doesnt happen to me
You have the 2.4L. I don't think they have any issues with it like the 3400/3100 does.

[boarder211]

3.4.... were there any other signs? I've been having my low coolant light flash on a couple of occasions, but it usually shuts off in like 20-30 seconds... I'm thinking it might be the cold here... but I've also noticed that the exhaust smells a little funny (well, I noticed it today a little... I think... ). Wondering if that was another way to tell?

[3.4Alero]

Went to add some washer fluid today and noticed that there is oil coming out of the lower intake manifold gasket :pissed: . I have been ignoring the evidence from when I changed my oil, hoping it was a fluke, but this definitely is NOT. The pic below shows where the oil is running out, and where it has puddled. Called the dealer, and referenced the stuff from before that I mentioned above. They said they can't do anything, because I have put 12,000 miles on since then, and if it would've been bad then, it wouldn't have lasted this long. But they were nice about it, and he suggested calling Olds. So I did. I talked to Siras, and he was VERY nice. Told me to get it officially diagnosed by the dealer, and then he should be able to help out. HE's going to call ME back tomorrow, just to check and see if I made it to the dealer yet.

But here's the interesting part: I asked him if he knew whether or not GM was looking at recalling these, and he said that all of this info goes into a database, and all the people like him who answer these calls file what they feel are "concerns" based on what they hear. He said it is being looked at, AND that several vehicles have already been recalled for LIM gasket leaks. Not all are 3400's but he said it wouldn't necessarily be for the engine, as much as which engines used a certain gasket material. The ones he could think of off the top of his head:

Regals
Luminas
'97-'98 Malibus (I asked him specifically about this one, since I also own a '98 Malibu. He said that not all of them were recalled, just certain ones, built at certain plants, using certain gasket materials)
'97-'98 Cutlass and Cutlass Supremes
'98 Intrigues

So it DEFINITELY looks like there is hope for this to be a 100% covered item in the not so far off future. And anyone who paid to have it fixed, or fixed it themselves, save your receipts, cause they will reimburse you.

Have a nice day!

[3.4Alero]

If anyone else is planning on calling Olds about this happening to their car, I would recommend calling Siras (yes you can understand him, he has no accent). He can be reached at 1-866-932-4368 ext 39337. He said he always checks his voicemail at some point from home, too, so leave him a message. Also, please have your VIN # available, because it will help them determine better whether or not there is a certain trend (year, plant, etc.). The more info we give them, the less time it will take for them to research. That means the recall will happen faster.

[overdrive75]

Originally posted by boarder211@Jan 31 2004, 09:19 PM
3.4.... were there any other signs? I've been having my low coolant light flash on a couple of occasions, but it usually shuts off in like 20-30 seconds... I'm thinking it might be the cold here... but I've also noticed that the exhaust smells a little funny (well, I noticed it today a little... I think... ). Wondering if that was another way to tell?
If you exhaust has a sweet type of smell to it, that is a very strong indicator that you are burning coolant. Also another tell tail, but doesn't happen as offen is a white smoke out of your tail pipe. This is not the condensation smoke that you see in cold weather, but if you see this in the summer after your car has warmed up that's generally coolant being burned as well.

3.4 did a good job pointing out the LIM leaks in his pictures by the way.

[K Dan]

I just had mine done last month. I found out the same way, did an oil change and saw the milky crap. I also had fluid stains on the head right below the gasket. My car is an 03 w/ only 28k miles.

[3.4Alero]

One more picture, even a little more telling. It was dark out when I took it, and the orange is the flashlight light. If you look right at the orange, you can very clearly see the oil stains.

[bigd6983]

3.4alero my stain looks exactly like yours. have you figured out exactly where its coming out and what have you done about(talked to the dealer, or just gone for the repair

[3.4Alero]

Siras at Olds told me I need to take it to my dealer and get an "official" diagnosis. So I'm going there today, hopefully. As far as exactly where it's coming out, yea, if you look close, you can definitely tell it's coming out the lower intake manifold gasket.

[mykah89]

took my car to the dealer two days ago for some service on my front end and they told me my lower intake manifold gasket was leaking , this is the second time ive had it happen, so it was covered under warranty, i wonder how many times this is going to happen lol

[3400SFI]

Originally posted by bigd6983@Feb 26 2004, 04:22 AM
3.4alero my stain looks exactly like yours. have you figured out exactly where its coming out and what have you done about(talked to the dealer, or just gone for the repair
This also happened to me. AFter paying over $700 to the dealer to replace the intake manifold gasket the first time when it was leaking coolant into my oil, the replacement gasket started leaking oil onto the block in the same exact spot that the pictures above show. It was covered under the first gasket replacements year warranty. But there is obviously something wrong with these "redesigned" gaskets. I'm waiting for it to start leaking again so I can go bitch slap the dealer.

[leroBob]

hmmm.... i was cuirious so i popped my hoood and looked to see if i saw nyhting, well i saw what looked to be old old stains barely noticable if u weren't looking for it, bought my car 4 months ago used from a dealership, so I am thinking that they replaced it??? hmm... wonder if i can find out? <_<

[3.4Alero]

Just ask them. If the car was originally bought there, they should have the history. If it wasn't, ask them to find out where it was purchased. They should be able to get you that info.

[Oldsmopimp]

Damn......I have the same stains in the same spot. They have been there for awhile now. I just figured it was minimul "normal" seapage. I have had no problems or signs of the "milkyness" in the oil. I'm at 36K with the 60K bumper to bumper warrenty. Do you think I should take this in now....or wait to see if the problem progresses? Like I said, I've noticed no other symptoms.

[Aleromaster]

Well I had to jump start my car today and just out of curiosody decided to look and It seems like I got the leak. There is quite a bit of fluid running out of that spot. Havn't noticed anything in the oil or coolant tank. Gonna take it the the dealership tuesday seeing that I will already be there for a job interview to see if they can do anything. my car is a 2002 with 51K. I will probably also call Siras but if GM is unable to do anything i'll just take it to the Ford dealership and have them do it since I have a 100k warrenty through them with only a $50 deductable

[3.4Alero]

Oldsmopimp, you might as well take it in just to be sure. They will pressure test the system, and if they find that it is leaking, you will at least get it fixed under warranty.

I'm taking mine in tomorrow (finally) for the "official" diagnosis. But I'm going out of town for a couple of days right after I drop it off, so I'll let y'all know when I get back.

[Oldsmopimp]

Well, as I was playing with my CAI tonight....I grabbed a flashlight to have a closer look at the leak. It's pretty bad actually. On BOTH sides of the block as well. :pissed: I have a pressure tester(cooling system only), but didnt really have the time tonight to check it. I'll do that tomarrow if the weather permits, or if there is room in the shop. Im going to schedule an appt. real soon at the dealership. Thing is....I have an EXTREAM phobia with other people working on my car. :( None the less....I agree with getting it fixed asap.

[99blackalero]

im almost afraid to open my hood now...if i do have a leak how serious of a problem is it to get ifxed, basically i mean does it have to be fixed ASAP or is it still safe to drive for a bit

[husker_dude_95]

mine is exactly like that too acually they said the same to me that they pressure tested it and its not leaking, well that was a month ago and today i was checking my oil and looked over and my coolant tank was empty so i was not to happy it goes in tommorow morning :pissed: :pissed: :(

[Kicker]

Anyone from Canada know how much the dealer charges to replace the intake manifold gaskets???

[misslindseysue]

Originally posted by 99blackalero@Mar 2 2004, 01:12 AM
im almost afraid to open my hood now...if i do have a leak how serious of a problem is it to get ifxed, basically i mean does it have to be fixed ASAP or is it still safe to drive for a bit
As long as you still have coolant and oil, and your oil isn't full of coolant, you're ok for a little while. Don't drive it cross country, but you'll be fine 'till you get the money to fix it, or whatever. Just keep your eye on the levels.

[bdunning]

Anyone do this job themselves? I am assuming by the price the dealer is asking to do it that it is a little complicated. Any one have a procedure?

Thanks,
Ben

[3.4Alero]

The Haynes manual has a how-to for it. I was gonna do it myself, but since it seems that we will probably get this on a recall (eventually), I'll let GM gift part of it and pay the rest. It'll get reimbursed once the recall hits.

My dealer did confirm that it is leaking. Quoted me $675.00 plus tax. So now I'm waiting for a call-back from Siras at Olds.

[misslindseysue]

My dealer also quoted me high, but it got a lot lower ($600 down to $400) with goodwill money. When they use goodwill money they have to charge it as if it's warranty, using GM's guidlines for labor time.

[Maverick]

Anyone know if the "goodwill money" extends to Canada? I looked in my engine bay ylast night and I'm sure I have the problem as well..... :wah:

[King Asoka]

Originally posted by Maverick@Mar 4 2004, 06:47 PM
Anyone know if the "goodwill money" extends to Canada? I looked in my engine bay ylast night and I'm sure I have the problem as well..... :wah:
i got them to goodwill the whole thing. The reason was because it had low Km's and i had all the previous work done at the dealer. Good luck everyone! GM really should do a recall on this and the rotors!! its a little ridiculus!

[alerosport.com]

any one had any problems affter its been fixed? mine was fixed like a year ago with the new gasket part number. The low colant light will come on in the morrning if you don't let the car warm up and you get on it a lil, i just let it warm up.....

[misslindseysue]

I haven't had the leak reappear, but it's only been a few months for me. If it's leaking again this soon, the dealer may fix it for free. Take it in for an oil change and talk a mech into taking a quick look at it.

[King Asoka]

i havent had a ny problems yet. Whenever im under the hood i always check on the intake to see if there are any noticable leaks. Ive had it done since last summer.

[3.4Alero]

Originally posted by alerosport.com@Mar 4 2004, 10:16 PM
any one had any problems affter its been fixed? mine was fixed like a year ago with the new gasket part number. The low colant light will come on in the morrning if you don't let the car warm up and you get on it a lil, i just let it warm up.....
Uhhhh.... if your low coolant light is coming on, then your probably....now stay with me.... low on coolant. Instead of just letting it warm up in the morning, why don't you check the coolant level in the tank, then add some????

[Crazy_Canuck]

Sorry. The original post was responding to a real old post that's already been dealth with. Please ignore.

[Crazy_Canuck]

Originally posted by Kicker@Mar 3 2004, 03:13 PM
Anyone from Canada know how much the dealer charges to replace the intake manifold gaskets???
Kicker, I talked to one of the local dealers here in Winnipeg just the other day to inquire about this issue.

He said that in the cases that have come through where the vehicle has been off warranty, they've covered it, but only after authorization from higher up. You might need to make a racket. (See the thread under the Canada / Winnipeg section).

[3.4Alero]

Well, after getting a good feeling about my initial conversation with Siras at Olds, I have not heard from him since. I've now left him 2 messages with no response. There better be a damn good excuse. If I don't hear from him tomorrow, I'll just call the Olds customer service number and talk to the first person who comes on. After this kind of treatment, I'm not going to be satisfied unless they cover the whole bill.

[smokinAMD]

Well, I've had this fixed once in the past. And guess what? I have to fix it once AGAIN.

[3.4Alero]

Well, here's an update. I called the 442-OLDS number and talked to the first representative I could. Told him everything that has happened, and that I was pretty pissed at the service I've gotten. He was cool, and said he would call the dealership right now to get it resolved. At this point I got a little leary.

Before he called the dealership, he asked me a few questions: 1) do you get your regular maintenance done there? (No) 2) Have you had any large out-of-pocket expenses on the car? (sort of... brakes, which they screwed up anyway.... and they wonder why I don't get my regular service done there!!) 3) Is this your first GM? (No my third, and the last two were bought new, from the same dealership)

So I was then on hold for about ten minutes while he called the service manager at my dealership. He came back on and said that Mark (the service manager) wants to "review your history" before he makes the decision whether or not to give assistance, and he would know tomorrow (which is today).

I then told him that I was under the impression that GM made that decision, not the dealership. He said that it is really up to the dealer, then customer service must back the dealer. At this point I knew what was going to happen.

So just as I was walking out of work today, my phone rings in my office. I saw the 866 number on my caller ID and knew who it was. So Matt from GM customer service says he has some bad news. The service manager will not recommend assistance, and GM has to go with what the dealership recommends. I told him it was bullpoop. He said he could offer me a customer loyalty coupon for my next GM vehicle purchase equal to the amount I pay for the repair. I told him that if they didn't give me any support here, that I would NEVER buy a GM product again, so the coupon would do no good. He said OK and told me he was closing the file as "dissatisfied." What a dick.

Sooooo.... As I was driving out of the parking lot, my car just mysteriously turned toward the dealership. I went there and stood at the service counter until the manager came out, and in front of a bunch of customers, said very loudly, "I just wanted to thank you for your support of a loyal customer, you screwed me." He asked what I was talking about and I told him I had just talked to Matt at GM, who said that you had denied my claim. He told me that he has no power to do that, and that Matt had only called him to get the service history of the car!! He then basically said all of the customer service people are dickheads, and asked for Matt's phone number and extension. He left a message for Matt to call him ASAP, and told me he will call me as soon as he talks to him.

Mark asked me what I wanted out of it in the first place, and I told him, "well, originally I was looking for 50/50, but with all of the trouble I've been through, tell him you want the whole thing covered." He said he would give it a try. So, now I'm waiting again. Hopefully I'll hear back from him tomorrow. Oh, yea, he also kind of reamed me out for my little outburst in front of his other customers, and I apologized. He said he understood.

[Oldsmopimp]

Wow...thats enought to drive anyone nutz! Dont give up, thats all I gotta say.

My Alero is goin in on friday morning first thing.

[smokinAMD]

Well I got some good news, I had my second gasket replaced for free.

http://smokinamd.no-ip.com/invoice3.jpg

That's the type of bill I like to see.

[02 Blck GLS]

I am suprised actually. I have 44k on my 02 and so far (knocking on wood) I have had no problems like this. :huh:

[3.4Alero]

Hahaha.... got a call from Matt at GM this morning at work. He was very short with me and to the point. He said, "I got to work this morning and found a note on my desk telling me to deliver you this message ASAP. The note says `due to elevated customer loyalty concern, you are to provide 50/50 assistance for the repair of the lower intake manifold gasket.`" That was all he had to say.

Didn't get the whole thing covered, but I'm OK with half. So now I just gotta get it in to the dealership. I guess the dealership really was on my side. What a bunnying ordeal.

[misslindseysue]

Awesome. I'm glad it worked out. Using goodwill money makes it cheaper, too. They have to use GM labor times. Shouldn't be more than $300 for your half, if not $200.

[3.4Alero]

Do you know that for a fact? I was quoted $675.00 plus tax from the dealer originally (before talk of goodwill).

[misslindseysue]

Well, I was quoted $600, and I paid $200. Overdrive's dad is the one who told me, and he runs a shop.

[Oldsmopimp]

Just got mine fixed today! :D Woo-Hoo!!!! Now it's time to mod.. :thumbsup:

[Final-Reality]

Should've said "Thanks! But you realize I'm selling my Alero and buying a Toyota as soon as you fix this..."

[mlcroy20]

Ok... this may sound like a dumb question.. but in the second picture on the first page of this post.. what is the part where the red and yellow wire is coming out of? (It's in the middle of the page) I think it's a sensor or something?

The reason I'm asking is that my car is leaking from around where that goes in at!! :wacko:

[bdunning]

I have a chilton with a "how too" replace the intake manifold gasket only it is for the 3100 V6. Has anyone here done this themselves. I really don't want to spend the money to fix this and my car has 86000 mile and is a 2001. Way out of warranty. Any suggestions?

Ben

[3.4Alero]

Procedure will be the same for the 3100 and the 3400. Just make sure you mark EVERYTHING very well, so it goes back right, and tighten all bolts according to the book.

Update on me... I got it fixed on Wednesday. $255 for my half of the 50/50, so Lindsey was right. Original quote was $675 plus tax, so 50/50 would have been over $350 with tax. Must have used GM's rates.

[Oldsman]

glad you got it fixed and didn't have to pay full price

[3.4Alero]

Me too!! LOL

[Voodosoup]

My car went in today.... And I got the leak!!!!!!

This sucks!!!!!! Along with the other stuff they are doing tomorrow it's going to be alittle over $900!!!!!!!!!!!

[bigd6983]

Alrite, got fixed today along with that hazard switch recall. warrantys are tricky, my 100 deductible turned into about 170 or so, something about fluids arent covered under my warranty. they have to drain the oil, so the replacement oil is 29.99, that better be some good oil, I will update on everything that was replaced.

[3.4Alero]

Yea, I think the replacement coolant for mine was around $25.00. I just wanted to run to Wal-Mart, buy the stuff, give it to them, and tell them to take it off the bill. But I didn't.

[bigd6983]

they replaced the gasket, had to change oil and filter, thermostat, and i guess I had some kind of oil leak, the gasket was like 4 bucks so it must have been from some kind of sensor on the block, coolant and all that other crap, but im just glad i dont have to pay the full thing and im glad that it was a year warranty so if it goes out again ill be down there. they also replaced my hazard switch, there was nothing wrong with it but my car was down there so i said why not, something done for free, you cant argue there. now I want to see if its going to get recalled and how much they will refund me, anything new on that 3.4alero??

[3.4Alero]

Nope. But I got my handy-dandy Olds customer satisfaction survey the other day. I attached a separate sheet. Haha.

Oh, I guess I forgot to give an update on what i've found since the repair. I went to put my intake back on and found that the clamp holding the intake to the throttle body was never tightened. It was just hanging there. Then, I found a wire loom just sitting down under my air box when I removed it. It's not connected to anything, it's like they just set it there for a minute and forgot about it! Still never figured out where it's supposed to go.

Anyway, I'm not sending the survey until after I talk with the service manager at my dealership tomorrow. I don't want to blindside him, because he was pretty good to me.