lovin every minute of it
 

hey just wanted to blog about my ideals.....


anyways long story short all in a nut shell here (dont want to complain too much)

P0420 - lower catalyst efficiency below threshold for the past year or so

-replaced 3 cats (not cheap) and my upstream and downstream O2

-problem came back, took it to dealer (in knoxville TN), they tell me cylinder 1 has a leaking head gasket (coolant), so i had them replace BOTH head gaskets....(arm and a wiener still under extended warrenty)

- rough idle still ramains slightly so they take top end apart again and replace UIM (again) gasket as well as injector o-rings

- rough idle still remains still no SES light since head gasket change, so i replace the catalytic converter.....again

- rough idle remains so i take it to the dealer here (in frederick MD), they drive it around with some scanner (doubting a master scanner now) and tell me nothing is wrong with it, and they charge me 50$ and send me on my way and advised me any further diagnostic would require OEM parts be present (all you can only see is my intake, and thats basically all i have now) /facepalm

- rough idle still remains this time (today) the SES light comes on for P0420 *lower catalyst efficiency below threshhold*....again.....


gotta wait till monday obviously but you can *insert frustration here*



car is under an extended bumper to bumper warrenty, i just dont know what this dealer will do about my hardcore warrenty breaking intake......i have nothing else to say but to congratulate GM on such a prestine, divine motor, of epic longevity ;)


PS. input?

Buy another car.

Kyle, it seems to me that you are the most negative person and everything bad it happening to you. I mean you never come on the site and say "Hey this is cool" or "I want to do this" you only come on here and cry about how much of a POS your car is.

Cry, cry cry cry about the motor. It's not a bad motor. Have you ever owned a early 90's 3800 Ford motor, or a ealry 2000's Chrysler 2.7? If you did, then yes, you would have every right to bitch about the crappyness of said motors. Also have you ever owned a 1974 Chevy Vega, totally stock, from the factory? That car was on the 10 worse car list. The Alero with the 3400 is NOT.

And what you post, doesn't seem to be THAT bad. I can see if you really got a dud or a lemon on your hands, but it seems that you have a decent car there. There's nothing wrong with comming on here and bitching about a problem with your car, but that seems to be the only reason you come on here. Do you have ANYTHING postive to say about ANYTHNG? I seriously doubt that karma is dealing you such crappy hands time after time and a little rain cloud that only follows you around all the time.

Like I started the post, trade the car in. If it's really an much of a POS as you say, then trade it and cut your losses. Then buy that car that is so great you don't even have to put gas in it.

This is Aleromod, not Aleroisspieceofshit.org

k wow, your input is rather irrelavant...

i find your directional input rather worthless, i honestly and truely think your mad that im not on the forums every single day posting comments of "yo dawg that shit tighter than a ten year old" or "i love your car, i have the same car but i love yours because we have the same car and i love cars"

i didnt even have to read all of your post to know what your input was......you talk about how i say this whole car is POS.......ive never said that and never lead to that, if anything all negative statements were always pointed to the motor, you think the 3400 is the best thing to ever touch the streets, only because you have it. me ive had nothing but trouble for the past year out of it......have i given up? have i just thrown my hands up and said "boo hoo help me jesus, what do i do with my life, my SES light is on!" no, i keep putting dollar after dollar into it, i drive it every day just like everyone else, i put my pride and sweat and all my effing glory into this car, and guess what it still doesnt give me the output equivelant to the input thats in it....im not sure if you have realized but i still own the car, havent made any effort to get rid of it, but only considered it. just cause a few things got me down doesnt mean all hope is lost, that was not how i was raised

like i stated years back im not getting rid of it despite its endless problems, this isnt about worst motor in the world, or coolest motor for kids, i simply come onto the forums to seek information and personal experience, but everytime i effin post its like, you have to come in and walk your walk like your aleromods dad and you know what im going through.

its such bullshit that you yourself have to effing put your foot in the door of all my threads and make an attempt to shoot me down.

i made 2 statements in my thread that would at least deserve something, and those are *instert frustration here* and "input?"

if this is your input, dont post seriously

I'm not getting into an internet pissing battle with you, I'm just saying that to seem to be a negative person.

Post something postive

Sounds like you need to take this to a GM dealer or to someone thats very filmilar with Gm products;

But rather if you do it yourself or have someone do it, First a compression test, then I would run a vacuum test on it. (see http://www.secondchancegarage.com/public/186.cfm ), and then run a test on the coolant and see if exhaust gases are getting in there. To me with the cats and the codes you're running way rich, witch is causing the cats to burn out and ruin sensors, or the sesnors are giving false readings due to unmeetered air or coolant getting in to the combustion thuse richening the mixture - then burning out the cats. Worst case senario one of the heads at some point ran hot and cracked. If all that checks out then I would attribute theses symptoms to either excessive carbon build up, or just wear.

Also note that depending on that mods have been made to the exhaust - a free flowing system allows unbured fuel and air to pass more quickly through the converter lessing its effect and resulting in carcon build up, vice versa, if the exhaust has been pinched, ie. parking stop, speed bump, whatever, the slowing of gasses can increase converter temps causing the substrate to melt.

Had a Honda odyssey in the shop the other day had two softballs of ceramic rolling around in the converter, everytime it accelerated one rolled back and plugged the outlet, the mom and pop shop they took it to before said it was just heat shields rattleing around and they needed and overhaul of the engine cause it wasn't throwing codes. Too bad they didnt see that the CEL light wasnt working either.

I just wished that my 3400 did better on gas.... now that the winter has come, i get around 250km (yes, km, not miles) per tank in city... on the highway, i get around 700km (all highway I know, but still) This is one car that I just dont understand. At least with my sunfire (2.3 quad) I got pretty steady mileage, with this car its just hit or miss... hell, if someone can tell me why my in town mileage is so crappy compared to me highway (I dont beat on it in town, and the 700km to the tank on highway was keeping the speed to 110-120km/h I'd be happy for the advice).
On a second note, I really think that the 3400 is a bad design, I had the front head gasket replaced at 75000km under warranty.... but enough of me rambling. lol

Ken I think it is unfair to say Kyle is overly negative. I think we would all be mad at a car if it treated us that way. I know I would not have had the patience with it that he has. Kyle I wish I had an answer for you. It seems that a rich condition may be killing your cats, (lol?) Anyway have you considered a leaking injector/bad injector harness? With all the assembly/disassembly your motor has seen I would not be surprised to find a damaged wire in there. Have you also been able to completely rule out all vacuum leaks? I have had a few hard to track ones that caused a rough idle and a rich condition since the computer compensates for unmetered air by dumping fuel. Double check the TB gasket as well as the tight fit of the MAP sensor. I hope that helped. I am sorry for your troubles. I wish you had the same experience I have with my 3400. Almost 140,000 mostly problem free miles aside from one LIM and ending in a blown motor due to my abuse. Good luck. If there is anything you need shoot me a PM.

Oh and if you want to try a different set injectors I have 8 laying around that I would ship to you for cost or the box and label. One of them is might be bad but I don't know which so you would have to have them checked but it's an option if you need to try that.

yeah i just have to wait till monday and im gonna raise hell and leave it with them.... i really wish i had the money for a second hand motor that i could just build the way i want it, that way i would know all the labor on it by hand...but im not at that point finnancially :( so ill just wait till monday, i dont feel like playing the search for thier mistakes game, when they were the last to work on it, so they have the honor to work on it again

just keep at it, i have certainly had my fair share of frustrations, and they will continue even after my built motor is in.......

this must be some extremely rough idle for you to post about it like this.. exactly how rough is it?

could it be motor mounts? - I seriously doubt intake would have anything to do with it :blink: and changing out all those expensive parts.. what the hell. I wish my only problem was rough idle :lol:

can't really think of anything -else- that would cause this rough idle.. do you have stock exhaust? check compression on the cylinders?

-- Edited post to be more friendly lol

yeah ill keep at it....the car is paid off, ill be keeping it for some time, like i said i would really love a second hand motor.

but anyways the idle isnt rough rough, and its definetly not motor mounts, because i had the TN dealer inspect alot of stuff before they claimed head gasket was my problem.

the idle is a fluctuation thing in drive i bounces between probably 675-850, and whenever i put it in neutral or park the idle goes straight to i wanna say 900, and it can stay there all day.....

come monday ill request compression testing vaccuum tests, and make it thier obligation to fix it

loox like Monday is gonna be judgment day for the both of us. Had no choice but to take my car to the shop on Wednesday due to heavy consistent smoke pouring out of the exhaust which through the SES light. Mech called me yesterday and told me the IAT sensor and O2 sensor failed, and that there was no real reason the engine would be smoking the way it is unless something internal died. The cost of labor to break the engine down and fix whatever it is with the mileage of the engine, I'd be better off getting a new engine, he says. If I do that, it'll be the 3rd engine. I'm not sure if you consider heavy-footing it on the highway every once and awhile "beating on the engine" but I've never had one problem with the transmissions. The engines have been lemons. I've already started pricing a new car because if the guy doesn't give me some good news come Monday, I'm turning my OSV payment into a car payment with the quickness

3 cats, multiple oxygen sensors because the engine idles rough?

Honestly, 3 cats?

Whoever made the decision to buy 3 cats is an idiot. Be that you or your mechanic. Seriously...

Did anyone think maybe the cars computer is messed up? That happens...

What about the easy fixes?

Seems like all and any easy fix was bypassed for the catastrophic fixes, which werent broken anyhow.

If your mechanic has been advising you, fire them.

good luck, hope everything works out :)

welp i guess im the idiot for when i first got p0420 the first time i replaced the cat so i figured it was things related to the exhaust so thats why exhaust items have been replaced. 2 pcms pick up the same code DHP and stock

Dude, some people have lemons. Maybe his is, and maybe yours isn't. Who cares, we're here to help each other. If you don't want to help then don't.

check your iac. that could be ur idle fluctuation problem. is ur exhaust totally stock? no hi flow cat? if its stock mebe you could just go get a aftermarket pcm with that certain code deleted...i know a few places will do that. im guessing those two problems arent related.

Some people are beyond help. I tried helping this guy, he doesn't want it. I know first hand.

I gave him my cell number once, biggest mistake ever!!!

I'm willing to help just about anybody when it comes to cars. I helped a guy in work with his Mustang, and NOBODY likes this guy, inculdeing me, but I helped him anyway.

Cars are my passion. I love them. I love to make them run better, or even just be fixed with OE parts. I've fixed my neighbor's Buick, and help point my other neighbor in the right direction with his Jeep. Car question at work are ALWAYS refered to me. God people I don't even know ask me stuff, and I help.

The kid gets a P0420 code which is either a cat, downstream O2, or something else (I forget right off the top of my head) so without checking the O2 or the other problems (or maybe he did check the other things first) he replaces the cat. OK happens again, replace the cat, happens again, replace the cat.

Now what I'm thinking is there is a problem that causes this P0420 code to pop back up time after time and the cat replacement is nothing more than a baid-aid. Could it be the O2 sensor? Could it be an error in the ECU? Na let's throw another cat at it. In fact, was it replace with a GM cat? Aftermarket cats, 9 times outta 10 throw codes on GM cars. Or could it just be that his mech sees him comming a mile away and thinks "Ha, here comes this kid, watch me make another $600 off him"

Maybe the car's throwing a P0420 code because it wants weed :lol:

VERY true. Im throwing the same code and i have a high flow cat. Since more exhaust is being pushed through it will pop up. Ive cleared the code, turned the light off and about a month later it popped up again. My car runs fine though....nothing wrong with ruby:rolleyes2:

^^ O2 sim, or a downstream O2 delete in the PCM works too ;)

hmm....how would i go about doing the downstream O2 delete?

Go to www.wot-tech.com and order a PCM with the delete.

Ben over there can help you out ;)

ken, its so childish how me and you have to play the point the finger game on the internet, in person im sure your a perfectly normal nice person, sure you'll piss me off, but im not gonna hold a grudge with you. i mean its just the internet and this is a community, a community for people with the same exact car, you and i have no need to bicker at one another and exchange mindless banter, if i post something you find stupid, do you really have to kick me when im down? when i see a stupid post or thread i just simply dont reply cause im simply not interested. but all in all Ken, i got nothing against you or your car or your opinion, just please stop acting like im that one hopeless person you dont like. if you can look past that we'll be cool

but, in other news of course no one knows exactly what my car is been through so i'll re explain a little better, i have replaced both my oxygen sensors after my second cat, i have 2 PCM's ; a DHP one and the stock one, i do not have a mechanic, just 2 exhaust shops i went to, this year was probably the second time its ever been to the dealer. i didnt just throw cat after cat on it, i eventually let my warrenty take care of it at a specific dealer after so many dealers rejected working on my car.

for all i know i could have compression loss on cylinder 1 and i dont even know it. my car does not run fine, so i cant just delete the code, ive even put a downstream o2 simulator and it gave me bank 1 too lean, the cat on it know and the past 2 cats have not been high flow, high flow is a waste of money to me, and no its not OEM, and i dont know why i should go OEM when so many people have replaced thier exhaust systems with other cats (aleros) and have been problem free, plus ive replaced knock sensor IAT and fuel pressure regulator and clean my idle air control valve (not for same reasons). like i said my car hasa rough idle thats noticeable to me, its possible i have a vacuum leak i dont really know.... im just sick of playing guessing games since i actually never had the money for a mech, until recently and whenever i would try to take it in i got rejected by 4 dealers because of my parts on it.......plus its under warrenty so that helps with some labor

not alot of people have the patience i have with it, all my friends tell me to just get a honda, even you Ken gave me that famous qoute "get a civic or a mustang", no i cant i refuse to, my car is paid off and i know it can run fine, it ran fine since 2002, all ive had problem wise is just engine, no wheel berrings no window motors no leaks, just idiot lights and im gratefull just for that. plus one time i got 33.6 mpg

i have an appointment thursday morning, hopefully they will find my problem or work on it...ill let you guys know what happens

I know you just had the head gaskets done but is it possible that you have a warped head? How is the compression?

check your fuel pressure regulator too.. when mine went out, my idle was horrifying, and it sounded like i had a monster cam in it :blink:

i'd check compression too- last time i checked compression in my cylinders I think it was somewhere around 120 - 160 psi per cylinder.. not sure what the normal is lol.. just something me and my cousin did when we found a compression tester

IDK about childish, but I'm def flabergasted now :blush:

lil update they gave me a lil hell about my aftermarket coil packs wires and intake, so i tried being real nice and kinda gave the "oh woe is me" to the service writer and said what ever he can help me with i would appreciate alot, so he is working with his shop foreman/supervisor and i told them to take thier time, no hurry, so they are keeping it over night since they are short handed this month. hopefully hear something friday

short handed this month? they're gonna be short handed for the next couple years!

Bah, stick your stock intake back on if it's really causing that many issues to them. And aftermarket coils aren't really needed.. bigger spark doesn't do anything unless you need to burn more fuel or something, just BTW.

Anyways. I don't think anyone mentioned the temp sensor.. is yours working? A buddy's build 3100 was idling like CRAP lately, and we thought it was just his cam. However, upon further inspection he was getting like 12 mpg, and running SUPER rich. Checked the temp sensor and it was stuck at 160* constantly, and dumping lots of gas into the engine. After replacing it the problem got much better.

Check for various leaks, too. EGR valve, vacuum leaks, etc. Things that'll hurt the driveability of it. The cat's not causing the issue I'd imagine, it's a direct result of the issue, whatever it may be. A master diagnostician should be able to figure something out.

well the dealer says they cant work on it....they say they "cant get an accurate reading" because of my welded exhaust and my intake.....sigh.....such bullshit, there is no one who will workon this car, this is rediculas:banghead:

i dont know what to do, im not going to take it to a "performance shop" they wont doanything my warrenty wont support them, i refuse to take it to a slice of shit place that claims they are technicians...

the only place i could try that i would trust would probably be carmax, and thats a toss up if they will work on it...

other than that im lost on who to get it worked on, i dont understand how you people get the dealer to work on your car if you have aftermarket exhaust and intake. if anyone has any suggestions on where to take it to in MD area virginia delaware etc etc please let me know

Little far but I could send you to my guy, he's in Lansdale, PA.

He won't BS you and tell you what the problem is

bring it to bel air and go to the mile one dealer here, they will work with you. your intake and exhaust can not void the warrenty, unless they can give in writing that it casued the problem, bel air dealership wont bother with that, I have done soem skimming so forgive me, but if u have had engine worked on recently, spark plugs may be not in the correct spots, i had that once when my limg was replaced the first time. I dont know much but if you bring it up this way, i can take a gander and give u my educated guess, i am in no way a mechanic, but knowing the engine i may have some ideas for you. if ur on AIM tonight, get at me dansgen1alero, i am about 30 min away from the city, or 15 mins from white marsh. If you have a tps-tec that may be malfunctioning too.

last 2 post sound good. I know dealerships wont touch my car anymore but there are some good performance shops in the area around me that at least took the time out to help me and through out some ideas. I think I lucked out tho because one of the guys had just finished up tuning a 400hp grand am with a 2.4L. I f you can do your own work, its worth talking to the performance guys, they know what their talking about.

If it makes you feel any better I think my car toasted it's head gasket on the way home tonight. I am lucky enough that it is so cold out the car barely overheated. I am going to check compression tomorrow and see for sure. You are not the only one with problems. I am right there with you man.

hmm i think thats stretching 2 states away from me :(

hmmm it seems to be a little past baltimore so it might be like 2 hours for me...

:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

I was wrong. It was late driving home so I could no tell where the coolant came from. Blew the water pump. Cheap easy fix. Thank god it was 0* out. I was able to drive it all the way home without any coolant in it. Had to stop and open the hood once but it cooled off pretty quick. Made it twenty miles. Just took a little longer than normal.

where do u live, i thought ur thing said b-more, im only 30 mins from b-more

who is he ?

my alero had a 420 code so I got a new cat 2 years later same thing so I did cat o2 sensors and full exhaust. prob went away then the damn thing rusted out :(

I must say tho I do love the impala and the 3900 very nice power. but I miss the alero (sitting in the driveway on jackstands)