Short Tracing

[cherrington17]

little more of an update, but its really to be expected.

i also noticed on the drive home, that my other lights are out. Cruise control lamps, window lights, etc. its like i'm running in stealth mode, everything is turned off other then what i have bypassed and turned on (besides idiot lights) even my fogs don't work.

i'd think i burned out my dimmer switch, but it still works on my dome light (all the way up turns it on) but then again, i was testing the wires before that was connected, and they were still shorted....

[kniedelm9490]

oh boy take a break for tonight lol i went for a few days with out the speed light s lol its was a paiin in the ass but i dont think in ur state of mind ud want to deal with it

[cherrington17]

oh, i have my gauge lights, those are in with all the other vent/door lights that have been bypassed. They turn on at night like they should. (although 2 [one vent, one gauge] are out, for whatever reason. )

[kniedelm9490]

lol well im sure ull figure it out then u can write a how to for us lol

[lonnie]

Cherry that all of those grey wires are electrically the same so it could be either one of the gray wires shorted to cause the whole circuit to see it as shorted...which means you would have to trace each grey from each light unless you can narrow down which ones you were working with or around. The bad thing is that its not exactly easy to do in our cars because everything is packed together.

Honestly it could be so many variables to isolating where it could be originating that it could take days to trace out all the wires.

Can you remember what you changed, or all the rewiring that you did, cause it is likely that a wire was hooked up that is shorting out the system. You could go back and start disconnecting one at a time what you got hooked up and testing the wires to see which if any are shorting the circuit?

[cherrington17]

the only one i was using was the one for the transaxle shift light...

so thats goes into the wire bundle behind the radio, which goes up to a T and then to the passanger side??

[lonnie]

So you have all of the leds hooked to that one grey wire? Also you know it changes from grey to like a brown once you get to the radio harness. It runs to the passenger side cause it runs through the fuse block but it should still be grey until it gets to the dimmer module. Have you checked the dimmer module that seems to be between the dimmer switch and the sound system electricaly and the module is just a transitor?

[cherrington17]

expanded below. ignore this one.

[cherrington17]

Originally Posted by lonnie

So you have all of the leds hooked to that one grey wire? Also you know it changes from grey to like a brown once you get to the radio harness. It runs to the passenger side cause it runs through the fuse block but it should still be grey until it gets to the dimmer module. Have you checked the dimmer module that seems to be between the dimmer switch and the sound system electricaly and the module is just a transitor?

I had them all connected to that. they aren't anymore.

soo.... where exactly does this change to brown? at the dimmer, that i haven't found yet?

it goes from the center console, up to the T wire bundle back/above the radio. Then goes over to the passanger side fuse box? The dimmer module is on the driver's side though?? (i only know of the dimmer switch) unless there are more of them hanging around that i don't know about.... OR unless the dimming/trasistors is controlled by the BCM control box under the glovebox....

and its quite possible that i burned up that transistor w/ the high power draw it had for that brief period of time. so just where would i find this illusive transistor/dimmer??


also, i thought this was odd. At most, i have, at the most, 20 leds lighting up the interior (5 gauge, 3 in each door, 1 driver vent, 2 passanger vent, 4 center vent, 2 switch panel) now, at 0.020A each, that works out to be not even 1A... but, when i put the new fuse tap in, i put a 5A in (thinking it was total overkill) and it blew it immediately. wtf is going on there? i still can't wrap my brain around that one.

[Cliff8928]

That's where the module is (#1)

[cherrington17]

cliff... i'm not gonna lie.. i have no idea what i'm looking at.

[Cliff8928]

Man, even I was confused by that pic when I first looked at it. But now realizing the arrow (duh) it makes more sense.

You're looking at basically the HVAC stuff from the firewall side of the car. Notice at the top it shows the ambient light sensor (for the headlights). So the dimmer module is bolted to a brace on the dash somewhere below where that is.

There isn't any better picture in the service info, but it does say to remove the closeout/insulator panel on the drivers side (the black panel above the pedals).

[cherrington17]

hmm.... so tomorow morn, i get to rip out everything above the pedals, and i'll see if i can get some pics. (wether i find it or not) maybe i can get a "how to" made for this, or i'll need some help identifying what i'm looking at.

i've ripped out most of the stuff on the passanger side, straight over to the firewall, but i can't say i've gotten even close to that on the drivers side. then again, the steering column kinda gets in the way...

[kniedelm9490]

lol u should do a complete interior overhall as long as your taring the car up

[cherrington17]

i would... but i have no money, and no fiberglassing skills.

[lonnie]

Originally Posted by cherrington17

I had them all connected to that. they aren't anymore.

soo.... where exactly does this change to brown? at the dimmer, that i haven't found yet?

it goes from the center console, up to the T wire bundle back/above the radio. Then goes over to the passanger side fuse box? The dimmer module is on the driver's side though?? (i only know of the dimmer switch) unless there are more of them hanging around that i don't know about.... OR unless the dimming/trasistors is controlled by the BCM control box under the glovebox....

and its quite possible that i burned up that transistor w/ the high power draw it had for that brief period of time. so just where would i find this illusive transistor/dimmer??


also, i thought this was odd. At most, i have, at the most, 20 leds lighting up the interior (5 gauge, 3 in each door, 1 driver vent, 2 passanger vent, 4 center vent, 2 switch panel) now, at 0.020A each, that works out to be not even 1A... but, when i put the new fuse tap in, i put a 5A in (thinking it was total overkill) and it blew it immediately. wtf is going on there? i still can't wrap my brain around that one.

Yeah Cherry I can't help you on that. I don't know the physical location, but like I said I'm reading the light schematic for a 2000. Now the transition to brown is from the fuse block on the passenger side to the auto park lamp relay in the underhood fuse block. I know this path is different in different years. It also shows that a brown runs from the passenger side fuse block to the sound system...whatever that means, but electrically it is the same as the brown that runs to the auto park relay. Dumb question here but are you using LED's with the resistors already built in? I don't know which ones you are using but some LED's have the potential to draw 40milliamps a piece, so with 20 that works out to be about .6 of an amp hypothetically. So if we think about this if you are tapping another circuit and it blows its probably because with the added load it is drawing to much current. So it depends on where you are tapping plus what is on this tap is it just the LED's or the LED's plus the regular lights? If it is just the LED's then you should be fine tapping off of and existing circuit, but if you are tapping all the lights in the car to another circuit then your going to have to fuse bigger. I didn't think about this before but have you checked all the bulbs to make sure you don't have a bulb that isn't shorted which is a simple problem but is also possible to short the whole system out.

[cherrington17]

i did check for shorts in my lights, and there aren't any. If i had one, none of the lights would work, since all the powers come from one distro block (one for each color) and a grounded line on one, would ground out all of them. Its happened, and its blatently obvious.

As for the fuse block, you just proved my own idiocy. if your first fuse is 10A you can't possibly put a 5A on the same tap... duh. when the first draws more then 5, its gonna blow the 2nd. its not like there is a diode in between, in the little plastic piece. I'm dumb.


and as for the transistor... I found it. thanks cliff! but... i unplugged it, and the wires are still shorted. If it was the bad spot, that should fix it, right? So, I guess I go back to tracing wires.

[cherrington17]

Cliff, if you want to add this in with your picture that you posted above....



if you take out the plastic insulator above the gas/brake pedal (it has 3 bolts holding it in) its basically directly above that) its the black piece with the white wire harness going to the top of it. and just to the right of it (in the picture. in actuality its up quite a bit further) is the dash light sensor

[lonnie]

Well that is good then Cherry if it is still shorted out with the dimmer module out. Then that means that we have eliminated the problem from the dimmer module to the dimmer switch and then to the auto park relay. With that said we eliminated that side of the module and the only thing on the other side are the lights. I know its going to be a bitch to trace those wires out but it looks like indeed thats what you are going to have to do, while you are at it there should be a 2amp fuse for the CRUISE SW LPS (2A) in the passenger side fuse box...check this for any signs of damage. I see in the drawing that the controls on the steering wheel and the transaxle shift indicator light are grounded in the same splice pack. Are your steering controls working? Here is where I would go with the trouble shooting now Cherry. We know 1 or 2 things here either there is a connection that is shorting out the circuit or a bulb even the socket the bulb is in or maybe a wrong bulb in any even this is what I would do.
Here is a list of bulbs that are in the circuit, and you can pull them out according to which ones are easier to get to.
1. Transaxle Shift indicator
2. I/P Compartment Lamp
3. Radio only for the 2000 and 2001 though
4. Steering wheel controls and there are two coils on either side of this lamp called (inflatable restraint steering wheel module coil) but only on the 2000 and 2001
5. HVAC control assembly
6. Hazard switch
7. Instrument cluster (5bulbs)
8. Power mirror switch
9. Left power window switch
10. Right front door lock switch
11. Right front power window switch
12. Right front door lock switch
13. Left front door lock switch

Now I would start taking them out one at a time and test to see if it is still shorted out. Here's my thinking on this again, either a bulb is shorted which isn't the most common problem, but is highly likely in this situation. It could also be a shorted light socket. Either way it has to be in the wiring between all the lights listed and dimmer module especially since it was still shorted once the dimmer module was taken out.

[Cliff8928]

Oh, and as long as you're at that module... Here's the pinout of it.

I/P Dimming Module

Connector Part Information

12034060

4-Way F Metri-Pack 480 Series (NAT)

Pin

Wire Color

Circuit No.

Function

A

--

--

Not Used

B

DK GRN

44

Instrument Panel Lamps Dimmer Switch Signal

C

GRY

8

Instrument Panel Lamp Supply Voltage

D

YEL

32

Instrument Panel Lamp Fuse Supply Voltage-1